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I just recently finished another playthrough of the game and came up with several instances where characters would do things that wouldn't really seem logical. Some really bugged me too. I was just wondering what are some of yours?

Firstly, there is definitely going to be spoilers in this thread so let this be your warning so we don't have to clutter up the thread.

My biggest problem with the plot line is when you first go into the underground right after Giott and the Red Wings duke it out. When you go and talk to him, you're not a dwarf like almost everyone else in the underground and mostly, you arrive in an airship like the enemy has, but he welcomes you with open arms. What makes him trust you? And then he allows you access to his crystal when Cecil simply asks where the crystal is and Yang claims that he felt someone eavesdropping on them when no one else did. I wonder if Golbez could've just walked in there and said the same thing to him and got the crystal just as easily.

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"Knowledge is power.
Power corrupts.
Study hard; be evil."

Cecil being a Paladin, I think others would have a hard time having no reason to trust him.

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

There are numerous instances of unusual storyline moments that don't really make sense. I imagine that some of it is due to errors in translation (some people blame Ted Woolsey for this, even though he translated FFVI, and not FFIV). The "spoony bard" comment is probably the most popular of this type. As for the storylines, I always wondered how the Dwarves can send you after the Dark Crystal without at least mentioning that every door will grow teeth and try to kill you. Or, how did Rydia get out of the Land of Summons without floating and even when she did leave, how did she cross the lava? Or how can you not equip metallic items in Cave Magnes, but yet you can carry them in your item bag without having them stick to the floor? When this game came out, I was young enough to half-heartedly wonder where the toilet was on the Big Whale. Ah, all good memories, and if anything, all of the quirks like this in the game just made it that much more memorable for me.

This post has been edited by Matt on 17th January 2006 04:19

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Cannis Rules: Balance of Power - My favourite Yuri's Revenge Mod

It's actually little quirks and Dei (and sometimes Diaboli) Ex Machina (i.e. plot elements that feel contrived) that I complain about when I say that this game isn't that great. The plot didn't flow very well because of things like this--at least not as well as did FFV (J2E translation) or FFVI. Its style of presentation was very reminiscent of the style of the first three NES FF games, which of course is no surprise considering that it was Square's first SNES FF. But I still don't like those awkward moments.

Cid throwing himself out of the airship is one such moment. Tellah's quickly-exploding rage is another. Things like "you're not a dwarf like almost everyone else in the underground and mostly, you arrive in an airship like the enemy has, but he welcomes you with open arms. What makes him trust you?" (sartael138)

It's probably at least partly the fault of a less-than-great script. I haven't played the fan-translated FFIVj ROM or any of the newer versions (Chronicles and Advance) enough to know if a better script makes a difference, but I'll bet it does.

--------------------

Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )

Quote (Matt @ 16th January 2006 23:18)

As for the storylines, I always wondered how the Dwarves can send you after the Dark Crystal without at least mentioning that every door will grow teeth and try to kill you. Or, how did Rydia get out of the Land of Summons without floating and even when she did leave, how did she cross the lava? Or how can you not equip metallic items in Cave Magnes, but yet you can carry them in your item bag without having them stick to the floor? When this game came out, I was young enough to half-heartedly wonder where the toilet was on the Big Whale.

Well, a few of these aren't that bad of a quirk.

- Obviously, being told that every door is gonna try to kill you and that a bad-ass wall of doom is going to attack you once you try to take the crystal isn't going to be much of an incentive to go get it. Let the damned thing rot there; no point in getting eaten by a door, right? Well, what you don't know can't hurt you... sorta.

- You can leave the land of summons through the town itself; the exit leads right back out of the cave. Why you can't just go back in through THAT entrance is a bti of a mystery though.

- It is a well-known fact that "bags" in RPGs are actually trans-dimensional portals. Every character has access to this dimension even when they're continents apart. So the items aren't actually IN the cave. Just in a plot hole common to all RPGs.

- Toilets? In an RPG? HA! XD What nonsense is this, my fine man?

The spoony bard reference was once discussed in an interview with the developpers. Apparently, Tellah was meant to be a chef, and took Edward on as his apprentice after he heard the news of him and Anna getting together. However, Edward's mastery of the spoon, or rather lack thereof, brought shame to Tellah's family name. As such, infuriated by his bad cooking skills, Tellah threw him out. Anna left soon afterwards. In the version we've all come to know, Tellah was made into a mage because the developpers ran out of pot around the part where they were writing up the sub-plot involving learning the Chicken Gumbo recipe to give Golbez a fatal indigestion. The spoony bard reference is an inside joke between the members of the FF4j dev team, and not a translation error.

All true. Seriously.

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

spoon·y also spoon·ey
(adj) spoon·i·er, spoon·i·est

1. Enamored in a silly or sentimental way.
2. Feebly sentimental; gushy.



Spoony is actually a word.....

And it actually FITS into where it is used.....

Does anyone else think the line makes sense, or is it just me?




Back to the subject at hand.......

I always wondered why King Giott never gave a warning about the cave to the group... or why the group didn't just throw the key into the lava, and leave the Crystal trapped in the cave, forever. If Golbez couldn't get to it, let it sit there and be safe forever.

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"And that, my liege, is how we know the Earth to be banana-shaped” -Sir Bedevere the Wise

Quote (Silverlance @ 17th January 2006 02:19)

- Toilets? In an RPG? HA! XD What nonsense is this, my fine man?

The spoony bard reference was once discussed in an interview with the developpers. Apparently, Tellah was meant to be a chef, and took Edward on as his apprentice after he heard the news of him and Anna getting together. However, Edward's mastery of the spoon, or rather lack thereof, brought shame to Tellah's family name. As such, infuriated by his bad cooking skills, Tellah threw him out. Anna left soon afterwards. In the version we've all come to know, Tellah was made into a mage because the developpers ran out of pot around the part where they were writing up the sub-plot involving learning the Chicken Gumbo recipe to give Golbez a fatal indigestion. The spoony bard reference is an inside joke between the members of the FF4j dev team, and not a translation error.

All true. Seriously.

Hey, I was pretty young at the time

Are you serious about that spoony bard reference? That cracks me up! I've also never even considered that it might be a real adjective that is being used appropriately. I always assumed that the original said "You filthy bard!" or something along those lines.

If I was Cecil, I know that my conversation with King Giott after returning from the Sealed Cave would be a lot less diplomatic than the one that occurs in the game.

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Cannis Rules: Balance of Power - My favourite Yuri's Revenge Mod

Actually I quite enjoyed the "Spoony Bard" reference. When I was a kid, I never heard of anyone called spoony so I thought it quite funny when I got to that point and even wondered what my reaction would be if someone called me spoony. Even though I later learned the meaning, I still thought it was funny because of the way I first perceived it. I think that's a little quirk that I'm glad stayed there. It brought a light-hearted aspect to an otherwise dismal scene.

I admit, I wondered about toilets too when I was a kid, but figured it to have been omitted for the same reason that they don't really mention that people go to the bathroom in books or movies. And if the japanese versions had it, they would've definitely taken it out in the English version because bodily functions and human desire are considered to be inappropriate in games.

And to support my original post, I would think that any king who sent these people away to obtain/protect something as valuable as a crystal and strangely always came back empty-handed would make me question whether they were working for the enemy anyway....or at least very inept at doing what a Paladin is supposed to do.

Also, why in the ending would Giott order the destruction of the tanks on the assumption that there wouldn't be another war? Human history has shown that there is no way to keep people from fighting each other and it's quite naive (especially for a king who has to protect his subjects) to assume that generations down the road there won't be a war at all. Why else do you think that the U.S. still has nuclear weapons even after they signed a treaty to destroy them all?

This post has been edited by sartael138 on 17th January 2006 17:10

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"Knowledge is power.
Power corrupts.
Study hard; be evil."

War wouldn't be a major concern to the dwarves at the end of the game.

At least while Cecil was still alive in the game-end utopian society.

They killed Hate Incarnate. People probably just aren't going to feel like fighting anymore.

This post has been edited by The Ancient on 17th January 2006 23:43

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"That Light has bestowed upon me the greatest black magic!"

The thing I struggled with most is how in God's name the dwarves managed to get all those tanks onto the overworld from the underworld through that big hole in the ground to fight the Giant of Babel.

I can overlook some plot holes, but that confused me.

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Is PJ

Probably the same way you can carry a hovercraft around on a flimsy wooden ship with propellors.

I suppose they'd need a few airships per tank, given the weight difference, but that hole looks big enough to support a small fleet, all things considered...

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

This is what I never got. When the Red Wings attack Damcyan, why do they just pass over it and explosions comes? When does Golbez have the chance to steal the Crystal? When do arrows get shot?

And how was the elder able to unpetrify the twins at the end when Tellah, supposedly the greatest sage that Mysidia has seen in a long time, could not?

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Dead Winter. A nice comic.

Quote (Barrylocke @ 18th January 2006 09:19)

This is what I never got. When the Red Wings attack Damcyan, why do they just pass over it and explosions comes? When does Golbez have the chance to steal the Crystal? When do arrows get shot?

And how was the elder able to unpetrify the twins at the end when Tellah, supposedly the greatest sage that Mysidia has seen in a long time, could not?

I think the animation isn't exact, but simply means that the Red Wings were plundering Damcyan--or had just finished--when Cecil & co. got there.

And Tellah, at age 60, wasn't really that useful in other respects either.

--------------------

Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )

Fabul -- How the hell does Goblez take over with the monsters he has? And why did Edward, Yang, and Cecil stay together? Any of those 3 could have taken out groups of those lame monsters.


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Targeted individual Jesse Radin

Quote

When this game came out, I was young enough to half-heartedly wonder where the toilet was on the Big Whale.

Since it's a completely different universe, i wouldn't be surprised if they didn't have excretionary abilities.

Actually, i would...but that's not the point.

Also, some of the attacks. I wonder how they can control the direction of it onto their enemies. Spells for most of it. I often wonder how big spells such as Big Bang miss the caster. More so in FF7 (Super Nova!!!).

Quote (sartael138 @ 16th January 2006 23:54)

My biggest problem with the plot line is when you first go into the underground right after Giott and the Red Wings duke it out.  When you go and talk to him, you're not a dwarf like almost everyone else in the underground and mostly, you arrive in an airship like the enemy has, but he welcomes you with open arms.  What makes him trust you?

I remember him saying he trusted them because he saw the Red Wings fire upon the Enterprise.

Quote (Matt @ 17th January 2006 00:18)

Or, how did Rydia get out of the Land of Summons without floating and even when she did leave, how did she cross the lava?

She probably left the same way she got in - she was carried by a Summon Monster.

Quote (Fadien @ 17th January 2006 04:22)

or why the group didn't just throw the key into the lava, and leave the Crystal trapped in the cave, forever.  If Golbez couldn't get to it, let it sit there and be safe forever.

The key wasn't the only way in. They were told Golbeze was in the process of breaking the seal (or else sitting in his Tower working on a way to break the seal).

Quote (Matt @ 17th January 2006 10:59)

Are you serious about that spoony bard reference?  That cracks me up!  I've also never even considered that it might be a real adjective that is being used appropriately.  I always assumed that the original said "You filthy bard!" or something along those lines.

Originally, Tellah just called him a bastard.

Quote (sartael138 @ 17th January 2006 13:07)

Also, why in the ending would Giott order the destruction of the tanks on the assumption that there wouldn't be another war?  Human history has shown that there is no way to keep people from fighting each other and it's quite naive (especially for a king who has to protect his subjects) to assume that generations down the road there won't be a war at all.

Hate incarnate, like The Ancient said. Also, as it stood at the end of the game, the only ones with any kind of military were the Dwarves and Baron. And Fabul, sorta.

Quote (Caesar @ 17th January 2006 20:40)

The thing I struggled with most is how in God's name the dwarves managed to get all those tanks onto the overworld from the underworld through that big hole in the ground to fight the Giant of Babel.

I can overlook some plot holes, but that confused me.

Airships or driving them through the actual tower?
Either way, all those forces would have been sitting there, waiting for it, since it would take so long to move there from ANYWHERE anyways.

Quote (Barrylocke @ 18th January 2006 10:19)

And how was the elder able to unpetrify the twins at the end when Tellah, supposedly the greatest sage that Mysidia has seen in a long time, could not?

Something tells me that Mysidia's full resources encompass a bit more than a single Heal spell.

Quote (Electricbassguy @ 30th January 2006 05:59)

Fabul -- How the hell does Goblez take over with the monsters he has? And why did Edward, Yang, and Cecil stay together? Any of those 3 could have taken out groups of those lame monsters.

By having alot of them.
The entrance to the castle seems like the weakest point, so you would want your strongest defenders to take the brunt of the attack.

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"I had to write four novels before they let me write comic books."
-Brad Meltzer

Quote (Fadien)

Spoony is actually a word.....

And it actually FITS into where it is used.....

Does anyone else think the line makes sense, or is it just me?

No, it's not just you. I, too, am rather used to people claiming that line's a mistranslation/Engrish when it's a real English dictionary-present word and a perfectly legit insult. I suppose those same people never had a fiesty grandmother who used the term all the freakin' time...

Quote (Matt)

Are you serious about that spoony bard reference? That cracks me up! I've also never even considered that it might be a real adjective that is being used appropriately. I always assumed that the original said "You filthy bard!" or something along those lines.

I don't believe he's serious; that "reference" explanation of his is just a case of Silverlance being spoony once again.

And that was an unintentional example of using the adjective "spoony" in appropriate context! Praised be!!

Quote (The Ancient)

They killed Hate Incarnate. People probably just aren't going to feel like fighting anymore.

But they didn't kill hate incarnate. Zeromus himself even states that he isn't completely destroyed, and both him and FuSoYa declare that evil (and thus hate) will exist forever, or as long as good hangs around. Least till the Blue Planet crumbles to pieces or somethin'. A quote on the matter by Zeromus:

I will not...perish...so long as evil...dwells in the hearts...of mankind.

So I'd think there's the potential for wars sometime in the future. Fabul was building their ranks back up at the end; Toria has their military, and so does Baron. Giott might've been a bit premature there...

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Words of Wisdom:

If something can go wrong, it will.

If anything simply cannot go wrong, it will anyway.

If there is a possibility of several things going wrong, the one that will cause the most damage will be the one to go wrong. - Murphy’s Law

Boing! Zoom! - Mr. Saturn

I just wanted to add that there actually WERE toilets in an RPG: Final Fantasy VI. They're in the Empire's headquarters in Vector, in the prison cells. You can actually stand on some of them and press "A", and your character will "use" them! You even hear the flush, lol.

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"Hate... ...hate... ...HATE!!"

Quote (Glenn Magus Harvey @ 18th January 2006 18:02)

And Tellah, at age 60, wasn't really that useful in other respects either.

The elder looked quite a bit older than Tellah...

Plothole #1:
Why does Anna die? The shock of seeing his daughter with a arrow wound should have at least caused Tellah to remember how to cast "Life". The same goes for anyone else that cried over someone else's death.
I definately had phoenix downs when Tellah kicked the bucket after casting a spell HE HAD NO WHERE NEAR ENOUGH MP TO CAST!!!

Plothole #2:
People in FFII/IV through some genetic trait must be immune to explosions beacause Cid clearly blows up which usually means someone is dead, oh wait the dwarves had pheonix downs which they had the sense to use on his MANGLED BODY, but Cecil couldn't think to use on SLOWLY dieing tellah.

Plothole #2.5
I'm at the Final boss in the newest version (gba) and so far, the only one to even remember that some guy named Tellah existed appears to be Edward. Tellah is the ONLY party character to *actually* die, but no one aside from Ed' actually cares?!! that's a little odd.

Plothole#3
Where is the mysterious Tower of Zot? It's not on the map.
You just sort of appear there and then leave.

Plothole#4
How did Cagnazzo killing the king cause him to be a GODLY SUMMON? Rubicante killed an entire kingdom of ninjas and they didn't get to be lethal summons... man did they get the short end of the scroll...

Plothole#5
Not as much a plothole as an odd observation. Why is it that Yang, of all people, manages to stop the cannons attacking the dwarves? And earlier he helped Cid fix the airship! Later he even appears piloting one of the dwarven tanks. What sort of other odd skills does Yang possess? Former mechanic? Government Scientist? Witness protection program? Yang and Cid are actually Edge in disguise? Monks are usually not that good with technology... something is odd with yang.

This post has been edited by Sykle on 23rd February 2006 02:45

RPG stories weren't as detailed as they are today back then, of course there'd be plot holes. Wasn't this one of Square's first character-driven stories anyway? Of course they wouldn't be used to it.

Unless everyone's making fun of the story, which is funny

Or, people are actually trying to make sense of these holes, which is kinda...meh. To each their own I suppose...

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OSonic Rave
/ \Last Arcanum
[ ]Strike Raid
XRagnarok

A plot hole is a gap in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic set-up by the plot. Ie, it's a storyline-dependant discontinuity. NOT something that isn't explained (unless it comes into conflict with the storyline.)

The term seems thrown around whenever someone so much as disagrees with the way the storyline played itself out, and rarely when there's an actual "hole" in the storyline.

"Plothole" #1
Anna died. There's no why about it, it's a storyline thing. It's well-known that in RPGs, plot-related death is irreversible (short of another plot-related event.) We can suppose that death in battle is more like being knocked out (and that HP represents a character's stamina and ability to keep up with not letting a sword thrust strike their vitals; which is why a puny jab from a sword could result in a storyline death outside of battle.) Therefore, the mechanics behind life spells/items would be to restore fighting capacity, not to literally bring a character back from the dead. Hence, Anna is permanently dead.

Plothole #2
Iffy. This isn't quite a plot hole because Cid isn't "suddently" alive after being killed. It's implied that he offed himself, or at least it was made to look that way. The party even expresses surprise at seeing him. But nothing explains how he survived rather messed up circumstances.

"Plothole" #2.5
This isn't a plot hole. It's just bad character developement. But then again, Tellah hasn't been with the party very long, all things considered. By the end of the game, the people who were in contact with him have gone through major traumatic events (such as Rydia being swallowed up by Leviathan and aging rapidly) that make some old dude's death pale in comparaison, frankly.

Except Edward. He's a pussy.

"Plothole #3"
Not a "hole" in the storyline. And it is on the map: there are 3 towers, in fact, near Eblan. As for "just appearing" there, let's be reasonable here: this is a game. For one thing, they have to restrict access to that tower (just like cave magnes, which requires the black chocobo, or the passage to the underground, which requires the hook attachment) so it being a visitable location on the map would be kind of screwy. For another, it's not a castle or cave, it's a titanesque tower rising miles into the air. The airship rising is probably the party flying as high as they can before boaring the tower to avoid one hell of a trip.

"Plothole" #4
IIRC, the king of Baron has always been Odin and was sealed under the castle. He didn't become a summon by dying (in fact, the library in the town of monsters talks about Odin; either they have a very, very fast mechanism for doing field research, writing a book, and publishing it down there, or Odin's just always been Odin.)

"Plothole" #5
What's wrong with that? From what we're led to believe, he blows up or otherwise trashes the cannon room. It doesn't take a mechanic to smash a few chairs into consoles (and as we all know, a computer console will violently spark and shoot flames when its monitor is broken; 70s sci-fi movies have taught us this. ) As for the airship, being told what to do doesn't require a master's degree in airship mechanics. Tank?What about Cecil and co. piloting the airship? How is that any different?

If you want a real plot hole, consider this: how cloud Klu Ya go down to Earth if all Lunarians save for FuSoYa were supposed to be asleep? What about Zemus, who certainly seems up and about? (Unless I forgot something that was mentionned; it's been quite a while )

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

About that tower. I always thought that was Babil tower sticking out through the earth. You see darkness at the base after all.

--------------------

Dead Winter. A nice comic.

Quote (Silverlance @ 23rd February 2006 04:39)

A plot hole is a gap in a storyline that goes against the flow of logic set-up by the plot. Ie, it's a storyline-dependant discontinuity. NOT something that isn't explained (unless it comes into conflict with the storyline.)

The term seems thrown around whenever someone so much as disagrees with the way the storyline played itself out, and rarely when there's an actual "hole" in the storyline.

"Plothole" #4
IIRC, the king of Baron has always been Odin and was sealed under the castle. He didn't become a summon by dying (in fact, the library in the town of monsters talks about Odin; either they have a very, very fast mechanism for doing field research, writing a book, and publishing it down there, or Odin's just always been Odin.)

"Plothole" #5
What's wrong with that? From what we're led to believe, he blows up or otherwise trashes the cannon room. It doesn't take a mechanic to smash a few chairs into consoles (and as we all know, a computer console will violently spark and shoot flames when its monitor is broken; 70s sci-fi movies have taught us this. ) As for the airship, being told what to do doesn't require a master's degree in airship mechanics. Tank?What about Cecil and co. piloting the airship? How is that any different?

Ok cool! all you're points were definately legitimate except one,Odin.

The King specifically says not to pity him and stuff and then "though I was slain by a Lord I was given ultimate power in exchange" the quote isn't exact, but the basic idea is there. He states that specifically for getting murdered by Cagnazzo he got uberness in return. Otherwise I really don't think Cagnazzo would have killed him in the first place.

About my Yang comment, in my defense the goblins (or whatever) that were controlling the cannons on Babil specifically broke the controls so that they couldn't be shut off so just smashing things more wouldn't do it. It would take a great amount of technical logic to smash the right parts or to fix the switches so that it could be shut off.

But most of the other stuff I brought up was just for fun... no seriousness
sorry... And thank you for the definition! I'll try to be more correct when labeling my plotholes and...stuff.

The King of Baron was sort of adopted by Odin. That seems to be the way it goes. Odin needed some sort of form to contact the living, and thus adopted the dead king's spirit. Seems to make sense to me.

As to RL's plot holes-
Well, it said in the game that KluYa went down to earth because he wanted to help the earthlings speed up their evolution so the lunarians could join them faster. He was the fellow what taught us about the Serpent Trench and the Airships. That is said in the game.

Zemus was forcibly sent to sleep, if I recall correctly. He was sort of using Astral Projection of some sort, I'd say to influence the hate inside of people, such as Golbez, and manipulate them from afar. Note Zemus was as low in the dungeon as possible. There was a reason for that. Over that bridge was the sleeping area, and when Golbez and FuSoYa walked in there, he probably woke up. I mean he wasn't exactly sleeping like a baby to begin with.

To Barrylocke- I think he was implying that one of them was Zot, whereas one of them is Babil. That leaves a third tower though. Hmm. Especially tricky since Zot supposedly collapsed, eh?

I always assumed Zot was a tower that was high up in the sky; sort of floating there. I mean it's possible. Golbez was a pretty powerful dude. It would also explain why Valvalis was there, and it also why when she died it collapsed. If she had power over the air, then you know, when she died the tower took a dive. Literally, into the ocean.

This post has been edited by MogMaster on 1st March 2006 01:04

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If you've been mod-o-fied,
It's an illusion, and you're in-between.
Don't you be tarot-fied,
It's just alot of nothing, so what can it mean?
~Frank Zappa

Sins exist only for people who are on the Way or approaching the Way

Quote (MogMaster)

I always assumed Zot was a tower that was high up in the sky; sort of floating there.

I also assumed the same thing, and I didn't actually see that as a plothole.

--------------------

Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )

Quote (Glenn Magus Harvey @ 1st March 2006 22:44)

Quote (MogMaster)

I always assumed Zot was a tower that was high up in the sky; sort of floating there.

I also assumed the same thing, and I didn't actually see that as a plothole.

I always assumed that the Tower of Zot was the top part of the Tower of Babil in the overworld that you see near Eblan.

Quote (bad andy @ 2nd March 2006 04:34)

I always assumed that the Tower of Zot was the top part of the Tower of Babil in the overworld that you see near Eblan.

I thought I covered that

Quote ( Me)

I think he was implying that one of them was Zot, whereas one of them is Babil. That leaves a third tower though. Hmm. Especially tricky since Zot supposedly collapsed , eh?

--------------------

If you've been mod-o-fied,
It's an illusion, and you're in-between.
Don't you be tarot-fied,
It's just alot of nothing, so what can it mean?
~Frank Zappa

Sins exist only for people who are on the Way or approaching the Way

Quote (Zeromus_X @ 22nd February 2006 19:37)

RPG stories weren't as detailed as they are today back then, of course there'd be plot holes. Wasn't this one of Square's first character-driven stories anyway? Of course they wouldn't be used to it.

*snort* A good example of this is FFVIII, right? This 'new' FF entry has plot holes big enough to drive a Mack truck through (amnesia! evil spouces!)


Getting back to the subject at hand, I didn't think that the plot holes in FFIV were too glaringly obvious. If anything, the new FFIVAdv created a few with "KluYa went to earth and had many children" (uhh... more than Golbez and Cecil?).

I actually did think about the whole 'hey, where are the toliets?' back in the day when I first played it. It then became not really important since the game also doesn't show a lot of other everyday things (like showering, bathing, eating, etc). Our heroes in FFVI must have been holding it in a really long time if they waited to use the toilet at Kefka's.

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kame, tortue, tortuga, schildkröte, tartaruga, turtle

"Arthur Dent?"
"Yes."
"Arthur Philip Dent?"
"Yes."
"You're a total knee biter."

Silverlance did a good job explaining Sykles's "plotholes," but there are a few things I want to add:

Dying in battle is not actual dying. The status is called wounded, KO'ed, or Swoon, depending on your translation.
I don't think Cid played suicide bomber. I think he just had a device that he set off and tossed up. It stands to reason that he was caught in the explosion (he did need to jump off the airship to keep the Enterprise from being caught in it), but most of the damage came from falling from that height.
Most of Cid's recovery time took place between seeing him blow up and finding out he's alive. The story seems to take place over the course of months, they just cut out the nights, the meals, the bathroom breaks, the idle conversations, etc. I think the saying goes "Drama is real life with the boring parts cut out."
Just because they don't talk about the character dying when they're in the middle of launching a seige doesn't mean they completely forgot about him.
The Odin thing seems to be a case of "If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you could possibly imagine."


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"I had to write four novels before they let me write comic books."
-Brad Meltzer