Track this topic | Email this topic | Print this topic

All right, here is my question.
What is your opinion about multiple endings in games ? Take Crono Trigger for instance. The game has 13 types of endings depending on what decisions you made during the adventure.
While Crono Trigger has many, Final Fantasy VII for example does only got one ending no matter what you do during the game.

My personal view on this matter, would be that it's okay to have many endings, as long as the game offers quality game play. What I mean is that this feature should not make the game short or easy just because the game offers side endings. Many game creators include this feature in their games as an excuse for the low value their creations represent.

Please share your thoughts about this.


--------------------

-The brave do not fear the grave-

I really like extra endings, particularly the kind in Chrono Trigger. The reason I loved Chrono Trigger's system was thanks to New Game+, which made it possible to beat the first game the real way and enjoy it fully, then whip through the game any number of times to pick up the side endings, many of which were either really funny (SLIDE SHOW) or very interesting.

I don't like it when there's a "good" and "bad" ending, and getting the good ending is next to impossible, especially when the game in question is an RPG. Investing 30+ hours in an RPG only to have it spit in your face with some lame ending where all of your characters die and you don't save the world just because you didn't talk to Random Girl A right before fighting the final boss is just frustrating and unnecessary, in my opinion.

This post has been edited by Super Moogle on 21st October 2003 18:49

--------------------

"I always have a quotation for everything - it saves original thinking."
~Dorothy L. Sayers

"The truly remarkable thing about television is that it allows several million people to laugh at the same joke and still feel lonely."
~T.S. Eliot

"Defeat is not defeat unless accepted as reality - in your own mind!"
~ Bruce Lee

I personally like them, 'cause they tend to add a lot of replay value, especially with the Chrono series, where there are about 15 endings (it may be hard to figure out how to get them, but that's where the fun lies).

And I agree with Super Moogle on the whole "good and bad" endings. It's really annoying when you spend all that time with a game, and then it laughs in your face ("ha, ha, you suck"). Except for the final battle of Chrono Cross. That was kinda cool .

--------------------

"I sat alone and I didn't care,
I sat two years in the same old chair,
I saw three roads but didn't know,
Which way to go-go-go"
My Coco, stellastarr*

Depends.

What I like is what FFVI and FFIX did - one ending with a few extra scenes depending on what you do.

So what would I vote for?

This post has been edited by Dark Paladin on 21st October 2003 19:35

--------------------

"I had to write four novels before they let me write comic books."
-Brad Meltzer

Quote (tenshi/akuma @ 21st October 2003 13:55)

I personally like them, 'cause they tend to add a lot of replay value, especially with the Chrono series, where there are about 15 endings (it may be hard to figure out how to get them, but that's where the fun lies).

And I agree with Super Moogle on the whole "good and bad" endings. It's really annoying when you spend all that time with a game, and then it laughs in your face ("ha, ha, you suck"). Except for the final battle of Chrono Cross. That was kinda cool .

15 endings ? I never knew...

--------------------

-The brave do not fear the grave-

Yes, give me side endings.

And not just side endings, let's have the ability to change stuff in the rest of the game, as well. Square tell a good story, but it's nice to feel you're not just being pulled from one preordained scene to the next. If I want that, I'll download some illegal pirate movies go to the cinema.

I understand Chrono Cross did this a lot, but maybe went a bit mad on the characters front and didn't build personalities up enough. I haven't played it, so I wouldn't know. It's much harder to get a branching storyline well developed than it is with a single plotline, obviously. But interactive storylines are the way, if you ask me.

I don't really know. It's true that one ending for a game gives a better and complete feeling for the story. Imagine if Lord Of The Rings had come in 3 versions with different endings in each book! What a waste of a good storyline...

But back to the subject! I definitely think it's ridiculous in Chrono Trigger with 15 endings. FIFTEEN!? Have 4 at max, if you are including multiple endings!

In some games, multiple endings fit very well (such as the Resident Evil-games), but in some games, I didn't want them. As Amido said, you have to make a good gameplay and value, no matter how many endings you include.

--------------------

People say I'm a slow learner, but I type fast!

Really doesn't make a difference to me.

I mean, side endings can be interesting. Particularly if they are funny and don't really change anything about the plot. I do agree that having one central ending that sums everything up makes the game feel more complete, but a handful of extra endings that throw in some humor is peachy to me. Yeah.

--------------------

I find your lack of faith disturbing...

Quote (Shirrow @ 21st October 2003 15:40)

But back to the subject! I definitely think it's ridiculous in Chrono Trigger with 15 endings. FIFTEEN!? Have 4 at max, if you are including multiple endings!

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Chrono Trigger Endings

In case anyone doesn't know, only 3 of those endings are legit meaning they can be done the first time through. The first two are almost identical, just depended how you decided to challenge Lavos. The other one is just by losing at any time to Lavos (did anyone else want to be able to go into 1999 AD as much as I did? It'd have been SO awesome to at least explore around a bit before Lavos shows up, you know? Definitely would've been the best epoch.) Oh, and they forgot if you don't get Crono back, which is again almost an identical ending.

All of the others are attained in New Game +, your 2nd time through.


I'm a big fan of the way Chrono Trigger did it, for the same reasons stated by SM and Kappa *blank stare*.

--------------------

The clouds ran away, opened up the sky
And one by one I watched every constellation die
And there I was frozen, standing in my backyard
Face to face, eye to eye, staring at the last star
I should've known, walked all the way home
To find that she wasn't here, I'm still all alone

-Atmosphere "Always Coming Back Home to You"

I like side endings, like in Chrono Trigger, and I was happy with one of the Chrono Cross endings. In fact, in general, I like that idea that what you do really does make a difference in the final outcome of the game. I loved Kingdom Heart's multiple endings.

I don't, however, like it when there are TOO MANY endings, and you have to spend years playing the game, just to see them all. I'm sorry, but I refuse to replay a game that gives me a "bad" ending, just because I let that ONE random village person die in a mini quest. GIVE ME A BREAK.

--------------------

Okay, but there was a goat!

I really liked the side endings of Chrono Trigger, because a lot of them were actually serious, like

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

returning everyone back to their original time periods, a Magus vs. Frog duel, the programmer's room ending, and Frog's spell reversing because Magus is dead.

However, Chrono Cross' endings made me want to slit my own throat. I'm probably biased, since the entire game made me want to do that, but when you've got endings like

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

rofl kid is a princess OMG

it just seems to bring the whole game down with it. Yes, some of CT's endings were silly, but pretty much all the endings besides the generic one in CC were stupid.

So do multiple endings if there are really different ways the game could end, and if they're not lame.

--------------------

Hey, put the cellphone down for a while
In the night there is something wild
Can you hear it breathing?
And hey, put the laptop down for a while
In the night there is something wild
I feel it, it's leaving me

anything more than 3 endings is rather irritating. being a completionist, i will go through to find each ending. but if its a long game like Seiken Densetsu 3, where there are three ending based on who you originally selected as your main character, it is very tedious. at least the end levels and final boses are different, some new stuff right at the end.

--------------------

Shhhh! I'm trying to hear the voices!

I enjoy variable ending they do give the game additioanl replay value, like FFT that would have been a good game to have alternate endings in.

I think they were a nice touch in Chrono Trigger but I never really had the patience to see them all. They're pretty cool but I'm not crazy about them.

--------------------

Lou: There's a couple of guys fighting down at the aquarium, Chief.
Wiggum: Do they still sell those frozen bananas?
Lou: I think so.
Wiggum: Let's roll.

Side endings are like clothing brands, great unless everyone is doing them.

--------------------

At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid.
Friedrich Nietzsche (1844 - 1900)

Yay for extra endings! For me, that's an extra motivation to play the game (as if the game itself wasn't enough). However, I'm not devastated if there aren't extra endings; it's just a really nice bonus. Having more than one possible ending allows the player, in a sense, to play god; in life, nobody ever gets to know, "what -could- have happened", and in games with extra endings, that question gets answered.
I do agree with Super Moogle on the "good" versus "bad" endings point, though. If I've followed my instincts all the way through the game, only to be told at the end that I was wrong the whole time, then I feel like I've just been slapped in the face. Thanks a lot, game. But even if there are "good" and "bad" endings, that still makes me want to go through the game several more times just to see what they all are.

Quote (Dark Paladin @ 21st October 2003 14:34)

Depends.

What I like is what FFVI and FFIX did - one ending with a few extra scenes depending on what you do.

So what would I vote for?

You just gave me a really cool idea. (well I think it's cool)

In FFIX...

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

After battling Necron you get to control Zidane (well you kind of do...you control the dialogue anyways), but you can actually live or die with him (like when he's avoiding the lifa Tree and all). Ending #1: You screw up. "Marcus" unveils his cloak to reveal...MARCUS. Ending #2: You save Zidane. "Marcus" unveils his cloak to reveal...ZIDANE. Rest of animation scene ensues. Congrats you got the good ending. (well unless you wanted Zidane dead for some reason)

--------------------

SPEKKIO: "GRRR...That was most embarrassing!"

Ya that is a cool idea it would kinda spice up FFIX a bit.

Quote (Neal @ 21st October 2003 22:12)

However, Chrono Cross' endings made me want to slit my own throat. I'm probably biased, since the entire game made me want to do that, but when you've got endings like

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

rofl kid is a princess OMG

it just seems to bring the whole game down with it.

kid is

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

the projection of schala into serge's time period to ensure that the will fo the planet is NOT carried out and humans can continue to live

Quote (gozaru~ @ 25th October 2003 12:19)

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

the projection of schala into serge's time period to ensure that the will fo the planet is NOT carried out and humans can continue to live

Yeah, I know, my spoiler was talking about one of the endings I didn't like.

--------------------

Hey, put the cellphone down for a while
In the night there is something wild
Can you hear it breathing?
And hey, put the laptop down for a while
In the night there is something wild
I feel it, it's leaving me

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

CC/CT metaphysics is really confusing, but I took it as a recombination of a few things I had read or seen before. Schala's soul is trapped within Lavos, and part of it is enslaved by the planet destroyer, and another part wants to kill the damn thing. In the future time period, CC universe, somebody's playing around with genetic engineering. Created are two creatures, the perfect human, and the perfect Mazoku. However, this perfect human, though based on Schala's genome, has its own soul. Sent back in time, yadda yadda, CC happens. Schala's soul opens gates and influences minds to arrange a partially Schala-fied Kid Ashtear showing up to fight Lavos. Once that happens, Schala's soul enters the Kid body a la Miro Ribeira. Now there's two souls in there. I don't know how they work things out in there, but it's clear that these are two separate souls. One is most definitely the child raised by Lucca, and the other is most definitely the Jesus-figure Schala.

Opinion time:

Now, it's rather obvious Schala, even without a body, has the power to open Gates. But, although she does want Lavos dead, she would subjugate Lara's accident to the greater task, and not open that gate. Ergo, she is not the "God" of CT. Who is? Why, that other soul stuck in there is. It's quite obvious that one broght up by Lucca would know about the quest of the CT heroes, when and where to stick gates, and would be much more likely to make the Lara gate. Of course, this could be interpreted as the Lara gate being the work of the Kid soul and the others being Schala, but I don't believe that. It's some sort of sychrony, with Schala providing the power, and Kid being the guiding force, which is what the concept of the "Entity" is.

Back on topic, the multiple endings can be done a few ways. I would like to see an ending sequence that you control to make it multiple. Ergo, it's a multiple ending, but it's decided by your actions during the ending, not whether how many people you pick up, or which character you picked first, or whether some little thing in the background didn't get done. I like the FFIX idea Nu talked about. About ones that exist now, CT and FFVI are the top of their form. CT does its multiple endings as a side quest, and it also opens up the replay value by a factor of something really large. It also opens up the element known as New Game Plus, possibly the most original invention in RPGdom. FFVI just has a scene for each character, in some cases, two. But it follows its own concept of having the characters drive the quest and not the other way around. In some ways it's like a fighting game, in which winning with a character gives you his ending, but FFVI surpasses it by giving the interaction and interplay between the people.



--------------------

My soul is bound to the Mistress of the Afterlife, and my fealty is to her always. So let's just hope she doesn't use it as one of her ten daily meals.

Chrono Cross Explained

this is the best website i have seen that explains the intricate relationship of CT and CC. i think you're looking at it a little to figuratively; it is more scientific and exact than it first appears.

Okay, okay, one more necro for the night. And this one, I can go back over a decade for, which is pretty hilarious - at least to me in my current dead-on-my-feet state.

For me, this is a bit timely because I've just recently gone through the exercise of collecting the endings for a far more recent multi-ending game: Final Fantasy XIII-2. Since I know a lot of people haven't played it, you can draw some comparisons to Chrono Trigger, because the time-travel mechanics of both games and the presence of a new game plus feature (in XIII-2 it's more of a "continue after the end" than an NG+, but still) lend themselves to the same manner of getting endings.

In XIII-2, you can't really consider any of the endings but the canonical ending to be "good" ones - in fact, the game itself calls these endings "paradox endings," meaning you've actively short-circuited the story in a way where you can't even consider that you've completed the tasks put in front of you. Some of them are pretty neutral, some of them are outright unhappy endings, but that is very much par for the course for the game as a whole.

Anyway, that's all kind of beside the point. I like what XIII-2 did, but more generally, I'm in the camp of "bring me those extra endings!" If they don't require me to replay the entire game, that is. My gaming time remains pretty limited, so I can't play through a game a dozen times to take other narrative paths or to build up my skillset within the game to get good enough to do overly-difficult things to unlock other endings (Cave Story is the last game I can think of where I had the patience to do that, and I played that game like six years ago). If I can get good replay value out of more endings without having to replay a fifty-hour game to see each one, though, that is just a great idea to me and I'm appreciative of the developers and scriptwriters who do it.

--------------------

"To create something great, you need the means to make a lot of really bad crap." - Kevin Kelly

Why aren't you shopping AmaCoN?

3 cheers for necro posting!

Now, onto the subject matter. Multiple endings are well and good if and only if they are done correctly. Sometimes, like in the case of Crono Cross, it just makes a game exhausting. Sometimes a game is fine with just one ending. Final Fantasy Tactics probably has the best story in my humble opinion, of any stories, and the ending is most definitely satisfying.

Meanwhile, games will multiple endings have a nasty tendency to have either very unsatisfying endings, like a few of them from Crono Trigger.

--------------------

"So, are you a fan of the Fett?"

"Nah, I'm more of a Star Wars guy."

I like additional endings, as they seem to emphasize a reality in which there isn't a single fated correct answer to plot conflict. It's also just fun to see the different options, of course: how your characters react in the different scenarios.

The first videogame I ever played - Warioland II on the gameboy - was built with five endings (with two additional branch-paths). While obviously there wasn't a whole lot of plot going on here, I think this style of multiple endings is my favorite: where there isn't a right or wrong (or good / bad) ending but just a series of potential endings. I suppose there are some games where good vs bad endings are more appropriate - FFX-2, for example - but I stand by my opinion. The only reason why it makes better sense in FFX-2 is that the game is so one-dimensional in its emotional content.

I do agree with Josh, though, in that its much more convenient to have access to additional endings in one's first playthrough rather than requiring a NG+. Unless, that is, the game is rather short to begin with.

--------------------

Currently Playing : Final Fantasy V
Most Recently Beat : Elder Scrolls: Skyrim
Favorite Game : Final Fantasy X

The newest CoNcast is up! Have a listen!