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I'm fairly certain that U.S. forces actually killed Osama bin Laden.

Because if they didn't, Al Qaeda wouldn't be acting the way it is right now.

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Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )

How is it acting right now? I'm not making a point or anything, I just haven't seen anything in the news.

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Scepticism, that dry rot of the intellect, had not left one entire idea in his mind.

Me on the Starcraft.

Quote (sweetdude @ 10th June 2011 13:09)

How is it acting right now? I'm not making a point or anything, I just haven't seen anything in the news.

My guess is that he means something I agree with: that extremists will view him as a martyr, rather than a deterrent for commiting more extremist acts of terror.

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Praise Be To Helix!

Quote (BlitzSage @ 10th June 2011 12:29)

My guess is that he means something I agree with: that extremists will view him as a martyr, rather than a deterrent for commiting more extremist acts of terror.

In fairness, agreeing with that statement is kind of like saying that you're totally down with the notion that oxygen is really good for you. It kind of defines the notion of religious extremism that this is exactly what they would think.

It does make one echo sweet's question, though. What is it, exactly, that they're doing now that is different than what they were doing two months ago? I'm not exactly a rube, though my exposure to breaking news now is less than it was when I was doing a commute every day; what, if anything, has slipped under my radar in this regard?

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"To create something great, you need the means to make a lot of really bad crap." - Kevin Kelly

Why aren't you shopping AmaCoN?

Quote (Rangers51 @ 10th June 2011 13:42)

Quote (BlitzSage @ 10th June 2011 12:29)

My guess is that he means something I agree with: that extremists will view him as a martyr, rather than a deterrent for commiting more extremist acts of terror.

In fairness, agreeing with that statement is kind of like saying that you're totally down with the notion that oxygen is really good for you. It kind of defines the notion of religious extremism that this is exactly what they would think.

It does make one echo sweet's question, though. What is it, exactly, that they're doing now that is different than what they were doing two months ago? I'm not exactly a rube, though my exposure to breaking news now is less than it was when I was doing a commute every day; what, if anything, has slipped under my radar in this regard?

The argument is (though I can't speak for GMH, only for myself) that as this continues it will do much less to actually end terrorism.

I'm not arguing that we shouldn't kill him. I am arguing that killing him is not going to do much to end terrorism. We must stop supporting dictators and enacting other negative policies in the Middle East. For instance, we, along with Israel, are the only countries that support Israel's occupation of the Palestinian territories.

Edit

This is a really silly point, so I'll put it in an edit bar: did you know that oxygen is poisonous? Seriously!... Anyways, back to the subject.

Now, I don't know exactly what Al Qaeda is doing, though I did see some stories about protests in the streets. But take the Iraq War. Many experts believe that continuing the war increased terrorism. In fact, looking at the way we conducted our national security that's pretty clear. Our threat levels greatly increased, not just after 9/11, but even moreso after the invasion of Iraq. By demolishing the country we created a hot bed for terrorism, and very much hurt our standing with other countries in the region, many of which that see us as a threat.

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Praise Be To Helix!

The meaning of my statement was that they actually sound pretty outraged at this.

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Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )

Quote (Glenn Magus Harvey @ 10th June 2011 20:04)

The meaning of my statement was that they actually sound pretty outraged at this.

Ok I see. I wonder if many of people that call themselves al-Qaeda would know either way if he was dead or not. It looks like he was living in a big basic house with his family, and one contact to the outside world. I'm guessing a lot if not all of them heard it in the news before word of mouth. I'm not saying that you're wrong, however I wouldn't put too much stock in people's reactions, personally.

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Scepticism, that dry rot of the intellect, had not left one entire idea in his mind.

Me on the Starcraft.

Quote

Ok I see. I wonder if many of people that call themselves al-Qaeda would know either way if he was dead or not. It looks like he was living in a big basic house with his family, and one contact to the outside world. I'm guessing a lot if not all of them heard it in the news before word of mouth. I'm not saying that you're wrong, however I wouldn't put too much stock in people's reactions, personally.

If basic housing is defined as living in a multi-million dollar house with an 18 foot high wall guarding it, then yes, I guess his house was basic.

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You tell me.

Quote (Iceman @ 11th June 2011 01:52)

Quote

Ok I see. I wonder if many of people that call themselves al-Qaeda would know either way if he was dead or not. It looks like he was living in a big basic house with his family, and one contact to the outside world. I'm guessing a lot if not all of them heard it in the news before word of mouth. I'm not saying that you're wrong, however I wouldn't put too much stock in people's reactions, personally.

If basic housing is defined as living in a multi-million dollar house with an 18 foot high wall guarding it, then yes, I guess his house was basic.

From inside it looks pretty basic.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/videos/...how/8143545.cms

This post has been edited by sweetdude on 11th June 2011 12:41

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Scepticism, that dry rot of the intellect, had not left one entire idea in his mind.

Me on the Starcraft.

Quote (sweetdude @ 11th June 2011 08:34)

Quote (Iceman @ 11th June 2011 01:52)

Quote

Ok I see. I wonder if many of people that call themselves al-Qaeda would know either way if he was dead or not. It looks like he was living in a big basic house with his family, and one contact to the outside world. I'm guessing a lot if not all of them heard it in the news before word of mouth. I'm not saying that you're wrong, however I wouldn't put too much stock in people's reactions, personally.

If basic housing is defined as living in a multi-million dollar house with an 18 foot high wall guarding it, then yes, I guess his house was basic.

From inside it looks pretty basic.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/videos/...how/8143545.cms

Wasn't exactly the Four Seasons... but perhaps that's what you get when you go through the route of extremism.

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Praise Be To Helix!

Quote (Glenn Magus Harvey @ 9th June 2011 12:20)

I'm fairly certain that U.S. forces actually killed Osama bin Laden.

Because if they didn't, Al Qaeda wouldn't be acting the way it is right now.

The media would broadcast reactions from Al-Qaeda forces that seemed outraged if we were supposed to believe he was just killed, yes.

What I find hilarious is how little people seem to understand the way an underground cell structured faction works. When the term "Al-Qaeda" is used, it's horribly ignorant to attach some sort of hierarchical, War and Peace top-down western military structure to that. Bin Laden is such a far cry from Napoleon it's ridiculous.

In other words, if the media is just broadcasting his death, regardless of how long it's been or if it's true, a good chunk of the "organization" that lost it's "leader" will be fed the news just like we are.

In other words, you can trust the news or you can't, and that's all there is to it. Personally, I don't feel it matters all that much one way or the other because I detest being fed second hand accounts of anything. All I know is that I realized I have no desire whatsoever to watch or listen to media after they started broadcasting popular Youtube videos and older than dirt arguments against western astrology as national headlines

Is he dead? Was he dead? When did he die?
I don't actually care. For all intents and purposes, one way or the other, his piece is off the global chess board, but not his memory- arguably a much more intimidating force, which is funny, really, considering we may as well have just killed any other Jihadist for all the actual results the death would bring without everyone's poorly thought out knee-jerk reactions to the event.

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If you've been mod-o-fied,
It's an illusion, and you're in-between.
Don't you be tarot-fied,
It's just alot of nothing, so what can it mean?
~Frank Zappa

Sins exist only for people who are on the Way or approaching the Way

Quote (MogMaster @ 22nd June 2011 09:57)

Quote (Glenn Magus Harvey @ 9th June 2011 12:20)

I'm fairly certain that U.S. forces actually killed Osama bin Laden.

Because if they didn't, Al Qaeda wouldn't be acting the way it is right now.

The media would broadcast reactions from Al-Qaeda forces that seemed outraged if we were supposed to believe he was just killed, yes.

What I find hilarious is how little people seem to understand the way an underground cell structured faction works. When the term "Al-Qaeda" is used, it's horribly ignorant to attach some sort of hierarchical, War and Peace top-down western military structure to that. Bin Laden is such a far cry from Napoleon it's ridiculous.

In other words, if the media is just broadcasting his death, regardless of how long it's been or if it's true, a good chunk of the "organization" that lost it's "leader" will be fed the news just like we are.

In other words, you can trust the news or you can't, and that's all there is to it. Personally, I don't feel it matters all that much one way or the other because I detest being fed second hand accounts of anything. All I know is that I realized I have no desire whatsoever to watch or listen to media after they started broadcasting popular Youtube videos and older than dirt arguments against western astrology as national headlines

Is he dead? Was he dead? When did he die?
I don't actually care. For all intents and purposes, one way or the other, his piece is off the global chess board, but not his memory- arguably a much more intimidating force, which is funny, really, considering we may as well have just killed any other Jihadist for all the actual results the death would bring without everyone's poorly thought out knee-jerk reactions to the event.

That all seems to be a bit apathetic. I'm personally outraged at the way the media runs. Maybe there's little we can do individually, but I certainly care about the media's control of information. The media, I feel, is to blame for not focusing strongly on these issues. If they did focus on them, they wouldn't be issues. There would be stronger anti-war movements if the media were free. But corporately-controlled media doesn't want that, and they have the major power to control information to weaken popular movements. This allows them to continue to profit off of what amount to imperialist endeavours. To me--and I realize that this is personal choice--that is nothing to be apathetic over.

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Praise Be To Helix!

I'm glad he's dead.

The world is a little safer.

Not safe. Safer.

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Join the Army, see the world, meet interesting people - and kill them.

~Pacifist Badge, 1978

Quote (Hamedo @ 9th July 2011 01:56)

I'm glad he's dead.

The world is a little safer.

Not safe. Safer.

Well, that remains to be seen.

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Praise Be To Helix!

Quote (BlitzSage @ 9th July 2011 15:11)

Quote (Hamedo @ 9th July 2011 01:56)

I'm glad he's dead.

The world is a little safer. 

Not safe.  Safer.

Well, that remains to be seen.

Is it so hard to comprehend that the death of a major figure in a terrorist organization is a positive thing for all those he would seek to kill?

"Remain to be seen." Hmph.

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Join the Army, see the world, meet interesting people - and kill them.

~Pacifist Badge, 1978

Quote (Hamedo @ 10th July 2011 00:48)

Quote (BlitzSage @ 9th July 2011 15:11)

Quote (Hamedo @ 9th July 2011 01:56)

I'm glad he's dead.

The world is a little safer. 

Not safe.  Safer.

Well, that remains to be seen.

Is it so hard to comprehend that the death of a major figure in a terrorist organization is a positive thing for all those he would seek to kill?

"Remain to be seen." Hmph.

Is it hard to comprehend that killing one person out of the millions of evil people in the world with the capability of doing terrible things won't make much of a difference? How many new terrorists have joined Al Qaeda since his death? Since we began hunting him? Yes, he was evil, but his death will not change much. I hate to say it, but it's the truth. I mean, if we could just kill one person and have our troubles die with him, that would be amazing. But this isn't Final Fantasy.

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Praise Be To Helix!

Well I guess you could say "it could be worse" if you have more, albeit less well-directed, terrorist plots hatching up due to anger/revenge/etc., with terrorists going for some sort of zerg rush strategy.

That said, they don't have reserves like zerglings.

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Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )