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So, if I were to make an RPG, and there were to be some kind of combination water+electricity summon, which would you like it to be?

Would it be a Kraken--a homage to Earthbound's powerful monster, completely with its infamous Crashing Boom Bang attack (make sure you have your Franklin Badges, people!), as well as other pretty awesome attacks, and of course an awesome battle theme to boot?

Or would it be Syldra--the (sadly misnamed in the PS version) pet dragon who

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

sacrifices itself in a dramatic, tearful moment to help your party save the world, and later lends you the aid of its spirit?

Or do you have a better idea?

Just FYI, Leviathan is a separate summon, and only covers water element.

This may slightly more complicated by the fact that, due to the influence of D&D, I'm planning to have several different categories of summonable monsters--lesser summons (imp, sand monster, bomb, etc.), legendary summons (Bahamut, Ramuh, Shiva, Ifrit, etc.), and a category in between that I'm tentatively calling sub-legendary monsters. If Kraken were included, it would fit the second category; Syldra would likely be in the third category due to its uniqueness. ("Legendary" is to creatures as "artifact" is to items--in other words, a unique, special creature or item.)

The difference between the groups has to do with approximately when they'll be available to the player, the mechanics of the summoning process as well as the behavior of the summoned monsters. For example, lesser summons may stay on the battlefield until defeated or dismissed, but legendary summons may only stay for a small, set number of rounds somehow dependent on the summoner's relationship with the creature.

(lol, somewhere in the middle of that post, somehow I typed "summonsters".)

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Personally, I'm not one bit a fan of crossover material, so I voted "other." I was tempted to vote for Kraken, and that would be my answer, but not if it were the one from Earthbound. That's someone else's concept.

You could use the biblical Leviathan. While the FF Leviathan is water only because Square designed it so, the biblical Leviathan represents the sea (so... y'know... huge lightning storm, tidal waves...) so there'd definately be something there beyond just water. Read the link - there's other stuff there that could be inspiring.

If that doesn't float your boat, you could always go for some other god of the sea such as Poseidon. Although apparently he was more of an earthquake god than a lightning god. Though the whole Zeus/Poseidon/etc pantheon itself could serve as a summon, combining multiple elements.

You could also take the technological route and have some random mechanical sea-weapon with an obscure name à-la Alexander.

Sumerian gods seem pretty RPG-challenged even though they're really cool. Enki and Ishtar are respectively the god of water and lady of heaven. Better yet, there's Ea, the fish of Heaven. Some sky-fish sure seems to work with what you have in mind, conceptually-speaking.

You could get creative too - maybe your summon could really be some lightning monster that rises out of the sea and, along with breathing lightning, causes a huge tidal wave to sweep over the opposition as it rises out.

Since you intend to keep summons on the field, finding one that matches two drastically opposed elements all in one may be a little difficult. But IMHO, you should keep away from other people's pre-used concepts.

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Personally, I'm not one bit a fan of crossover material,

I intend it not so much to be a crossover as just a reference, such as a description that says "legendary sea monster with unusual control of sound and electricity", and attacks like "Explosive Noise" that is "inexplicably" (*ahem*) electric elemental (as opposed to actually calling the attack itself "Crashing Boom Bang", which, apart from it just being a direct ripoff, also wouldn't sit right with the serious tone I intend for the game).

Quote (Silverlance)

You could use the biblical Leviathan.

I'd rather keep Leviathan as a reference to the FF series Leviathan. If anything, I'd more readily make reference to the MMZ series Leviathan (such as with an "ice dragon" attack or something).

As a sidenote, I see myself drawing from an unusual source of inspirational material for various aspects of my game--other videogames, and sometimes various things from popular culture (as opposed to mythology, history, literature, etc.). Maybe I subconsciously want to see videogame lore become as "legendary" as these things...

As for Sumerian mythology, maybe I could research that a bit and put some stuff in, since I have a tendency to try to help underdogs, and it seems to be somewhat underrated. (As opposed to Tolkien mythology, which appears in just about every freaking western fantasy setting, grr....)

Quote (Silverlance)

But IMHO, you should keep away from other people's pre-used concepts.

One thing I plan on doing with my game is not putting so much emphasis on innovation but much more emphasis on combining tried-and-true features that could really make for a truly very fun gameplay experience.

Quote (Silverlance)

Since you intend to keep summons on the field, finding one that matches two drastically opposed elements all in one may be a little difficult.

Not sure what you mean by this.

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Quote (Silverlance)

Some sky-fish sure seems to work with what you have in mind, conceptually-speaking.

Interesting that you mention this. Thanks for the idea; I could make a "Sky Fish" summon as an intermediate-class summon, a very fast monster that is greatly affected by unnatural changes in the flow of time, as a reference to both cryptozoology (as is Kraken) and Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow.

This post has been edited by Glenn Magus Harvey on 30th April 2007 03:56

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Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

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Kraken's not just from Earthbound; it's a mythological monster, too. That's why I voted for it.

Apologies if this has already been mentioned, I could only skim the thread.

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Bahamut would be a good cross-over type monster....something dragon like would be good...(just a suggestion)

I voted Syldra, mostly because I love FFV, but more importantly, being a summon doesn't restrict it to "one monster" in the storyline, just as the attacker.

Case and Point:
I was gonna make a joke about, "Use Squirtle and Pikachu! Their Water/electric blast in the show was hardcore!" And in that thought, I realized, why not use a water elemental paired with a lightning elemental as the summon?

Seriously, Ramuh riding in on Leviathan would rock extra hard!

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Quote (Final Fantasy Guru @ 30th April 2007 16:43)

Bahamut would be a good cross-over type monster....something dragon like would be good...(just a suggestion)

Heh, Bahamut originally was a turtle in pre-Islam Arabic myth, but I think that GMH is more concerned about video game references then mythological factoids. Thor is an option, as the Norse god of thunder, but so is Aegir, who was a Jotun-turned-Aesir who ruled over ocean storms (Njord was the god of calmer waters).

The Japanese god Susanoo is also a good choice, as he is the god of the sea and of thunder and lightning (he is part of the "Shinto trinity" along with the sun goddess Amaterasu and the moon god Tsukuyomi). Susanoo is usually depicted as a samurai warrior armed with the Kusanagi sword, which he had drawn from the eight-headed Orochi serpent. The Kusanagi is one of Japan's mythological "three sacred treasures" to which you can find references everywhere.

If you want to make this strictly a video game reference, then you can make it a joke of sorts with Volt Catfish or Squid Adler from the MMX series. Other gaming-oriented options might be Rhaknam from Skies of Arcadia, which was a huge flying arcwhale with ice and storm powers, or delve into the pokemon world with a water/electric type like Lanturn.

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Out of curiousity, and a lil' off-topic, what is this being made in?

Is it a tabletop RPG, scripted using a game engine of some sort, or programmed with a programming language? Or just theorizing on how things would be in a game?

I'm kinda interested.

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If you want to make this strictly a video game reference, then you can make it a joke of sorts with Volt Catfish or Squid Adler from the MMX series. Other gaming-oriented options might be Rhaknam from Skies of Arcadia, which was a huge flying arcwhale with ice and storm powers, or delve into the pokemon world with a water/electric type like Lanturn.

I already have various references to Pokemon, and I haven't played Skies of Arcadia before (maybe I should--that, Dragon Quest, and Phantasy Star). As for the MMX series...I'm actually planning a massive reference to the MM series, in the form of a specialized set of magic spells--thanks to Volt Catfish's own Triad Thunder for inspiring my doing that.

Quote (Silverlance)

Is it a tabletop RPG, scripted using a game engine of some sort, or programmed with a programming language? Or just theorizing on how things would be in a game?

None of the above; remember my mentioning it several times before, that I'm making a FF-style RPG--where "making" so far has meant "brainstorming ideas and writing them down and/or typing them into files on my computer". No, there isn't yet any programming involved; I'm more so trying to put together and refine my ideas before I try to program it, and there's the reason that I don't actually know how to program anything useful (that's everything from programming languages to contact detection).

This topic might belong in Your Creations, but I felt the question was general enough for it to be included in General Gaming (and not General Squenix since it involved the Kraken).

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Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )