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i've always wondered, why is rap music bashed by people?

i mean, they say they objectify the women in their videos. well, those woemn wanted to be invideos, so they obviously knew what it would mean. the lyrics cause people to comit violent acts? anyone who can be influenced by the music doesn't need to be allowed in public in the first place. if i made a rap song aboput climbing a mountain, would you go hiking? you just plain don't understand it? well, i don't get punk rock, or emo rock, or whatever the media's callin it.

so please tell me, why don't you like rap? if you like, post your theories anyway.

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moé in the streets, senpai in the sheets

I don't dislike it because there are boobiez in the videos, I dislike it for the same reason you may dislike death metal, it just isn't my type of music.

I'm not into rap, all the rap I hear comes from the radio or my sister's CD player, so I can't talk well-versedly and with confidence about the genre as I can with some other types of music. The thing is, though, it all sounds the same to me. The voices grate on my nerves, the themes are repetetive (violence, love for yo' brothas or the aforementioned boobiez), the 'beats' don't seem to stray that far out of the norm (I need more rap with three/five beats in a bar, I like irregularity in my music) and the hooks, though catchy, don't really appeal to me, not like a sweet slide-guitar riff does. I'm not listing these as negatives, just as things that don't appeal or are a turn off to me.

Of course, that's not to say that, to me, rap is the worst thing ever. Rapping itself, from what I gather from 8 Mile, seems to take a tremendous amount of talent. I've enjoyed, in a jokey sort of way, some 'old-school' rap with my 'homies' like the Jurassic 5, who were pretty unique, but other than that, it's just not to my tastes. I can't identify with it, and what seems like amazing artistic talent to some is simply annoying and samey to me. Keep in mind, this all comes from someone who has literally no experience with the genre.

On the subject of objectifying women, it's not so much the people in the videos as the message these videos convey. Influential media is just that: influential. Video games won't cause you to become violent, nor will rap make a thug out of you. But younger people tend to immitate what they see and like, and this kind of music can convey a very bad image to them. Don't believe me? Just look at your average "lol I'm the coolest thing on the block" kid trying to act ghetto-thug-ish. Listen to them talking.

Parents ARE often to blame, especially when they let their children listen to things they shouldn't. But parents can't always control everything their kids do. When you were a kid and played video games, didn't you fantasise about being in them? Or even played out the fantasy by hitting trees with wooden sticks and pretending they were monsters and such? The same goes for these kids. Only these fantasies are far more real than orcs and slimes, and could get them in serious legal trouble.

Aside from that, good rap music is rare. The average rap song involves provocative lyrics centered around sex, murder, money, drugs, gangs, and so forth. Many rap songs attempt to make it on these themes alone and turn out being little more than fantasy-based rants about "da streets yo!" The rest? "Yo yo dawg I gots the bling-bling thanks to mah mad rhymes and you don't." Imagine playing a good RPG: you'll love it, because you're a fan of RPGs. Now suppose Square came up with a rather sub-par FF in their series. Being an FF fan, you'd probably play it anyways and try to find strong points. But to the initiated who don't share your love, it'll just be a piece of steaming crap that wasted $75 of their hard-earned green.

Of course, there ARE good rap songs. But finding good material that doesn't rely on ranting about the above themes to appeal to people is hard, and often hardly worth the effort.

Just my $0.02. Dawg.

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

I think you should give your definition of 'rap' otherwise we won't get far. Does your definition encompass spoken word, hiphop, turntablism, G-Funk, and Gangsta? Or are we talking specificly about Commerical (Gangsta) Rap Music? Championed by the likes of Jay Z, 50 Cent, Puff Daddy, et al? Because if this latter example is the case, it's very simple, I hate rap because it is takes an all encompassing and varied musical movement, that is HipHop, and stagnates it into a stereotyped and overproduced cliche of 'street' black versus 'the law' of white, artists treat themselves as the one true original martyr, having absolutely no respect for anyone buy themselves, they ALL claim to have 'rolled' with 2Pac, they can't seem to see past anything in life that has 1) Monetary value and 2) street cred, and finaly, they seem proud of owning guns and pushing drugs. For one example, 50 Cent speaks proudly that he used to deal Crack. Well excellent! Congratulation on contributing to the downfall of the young and poor black communities of America.

Heres a gold star. Go put it on your chart, thats a good lad.

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Whether you take the doughnut hole as a blank space or as an entity unto itself is a purely metaphysical question and does not affect the taste of the doughnut one bit.

http://slightly-bitter.blog.co.uk

I was going to attribute to this topic, though it seems that most, if not all, of my opinions on "rap music" is mirrored by Silverlance and Basssic's previous posts. But I'll put in my reason for not liking rap.

Putting aside the fact that rap is the most generic, most formulaic, most repetitive genre of music today ... Putting aside the idealism in most rap music being "banging ho's", "busting caps", "killing Pigs", "repping the west/east side", "how down with the street they are", "bling bling", "spinner rims", and a so-called "east coast/west coast rivalry" ... Putting aside all the stupid "rivalries" between these different guys (I don't watch any entertainment celebrity tv, I don't ready any mainstream articles, I dont watch MTV at all, and I don't come in contact with any outside media presence to anything I don't want to know about. Yet somehow I know, and am sick of, this "rivalry" between "The Game" and "50 Cent". Why does this sort of thing happen? How can rapping incite hatred between two people? Rap is the only genre of music that has hate crimes, and I mean that by pointing at things like Biggie and Tupac. No rock star has ever died as a result of a "rivalry" with another rock band). Also putting aside the fact that I think that all that rap is is talking in rhythm over a multi-layered synthpop beat repeated over and over and over.

Putting ALL THAT aside, rap just isn't my cup of tea. I'd rather hear an electrifying guitar riff with a thick bassline wrapped up with a tricky drumline while the vocalist is screaming his lungs out than it.
But I do enjoy some hip-hop (though practically none of it coming this century). I enjoy Cypress Hill, Outkast, Beastie Boys, Eric B. & Rakim, Saul Williams, older LL Cool J, and a couple others.

It's just that everything coming out today is complete garbage (in both rap and rock). It's been done over and over and over. There just aren't any bands, or rappers, that have come out recently that's done anything revolutionary for the industry (and don't say The Killers have saved music, cuz theyre killing it more than saving it, believe you me). Why can't the people coming up in either genre come up with something different?

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"When I turn the page
The corner bends into the perfect dog ear
As if the words knew I'd need them again
But at the time, I didn't see it."

~"This Ain't a Surfin' Movie" - Minus the Bear

I've said it before, but hip-hop as a genre has a capacity to be very thought-provoking, and the most talented DJs and producers certainly maintain a level of musical significance. But so much of today's rap artists are obsessed with violence, sex, drugs, and themselves, to the point that their songs lose all sense of meaning. There are a few rare modern instances of excellence, but they are far overshadowed by the decadent, vapid thing that mainstream hip-hop culture has become.

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"I always have a quotation for everything - it saves original thinking."
~Dorothy L. Sayers

"The truly remarkable thing about television is that it allows several million people to laugh at the same joke and still feel lonely."
~T.S. Eliot

"Defeat is not defeat unless accepted as reality - in your own mind!"
~ Bruce Lee

Well I don't hate rap music at all, and I do enjoy it. I do not however support anyone who thinks they're big for treating women like c***, scaring people by carrying guns and filling people's minds with negative thoughts. Some might argue that video games do the same thing. But video games have ratings and you can see the consequences of such actions. And most gamers are smart enough to realise its a game. However music requires imagination and does effect mood. So I'm very careful what I listen to. If I hear rappers go on about how good they are for being jokes of criminals I will switch off. Otherwise I'm good with it.

Another beef you can add to it is that rap, spawns another hated social group. Wannabe rappers, I don't know what it's like in the States ( I guessing your wannabe rappers aren't such try hards), but in Australia it is very sad, we have so many imitators all trying to be tupac, 50 cent oh and now white Australians are trying to be Eminem, have you heard an aussie rap. If you haven't take my advice and cover your ears.

My advice just enjoy what you like, whatever it is and if it isn't decent by social standards, keep it behind closed doors.

Quote (Malevolence @ 14th June 2005 16:28)

i've always wondered, why is rap music bashed by people?

i mean, they say they objectify the women in their videos. well, those woemn wanted to be invideos, so they obviously knew what it would mean. the lyrics cause people to comit violent acts? anyone who can be influenced by the music doesn't need to be allowed in public in the first place. if i made a rap song aboput climbing a mountain, would you go hiking? you just plain don't understand it? well, i don't get punk rock, or emo rock, or whatever the media's callin it.

so please tell me, why don't you like rap? if you like, post your theories anyway.

Because it sucks. Your reasons are irrelevant.

And remember, kids! You can't spell "CRAP" withought "RAP!"

Moderator Edit

You've been here two days and you're being a troll? Watch yourself. -R51

EDIT: Sorry. I was kinda being sarcastic, though. I mean, I don't like rap, but I was mimicking my friends with the CRAP thing, but I guess y'all wouldn't know that. Anywho, my bad

This post has been edited by Spiffyness on 15th June 2005 04:43

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The island bathes in the sun's bright rays
Distant hills wear a shroud of grey
A lonely breeze whispers in the trees
Sole witness to history

ICO-You were there-

That's one thing that seems to be less discussed: the actual music itself.

Most rap involves a short syth sample playing over a drumloop. Repeatedly. Start to finish. Occasionally, it'll get creative and another instrument (usually a high-pitched one) will join in for "important" parts (like when a chorus of effiminated men sing about hope in the streets or something like that.)

What... is that it? Seriously, what the hell? That's not music. There's hardly any effort there! Other genres can take even basic elements of a song, slap them together, and sound great. Why doesn't rap do that? Why can't the genre at least support itself by putting effort in the music if the lyrics are doomed to remain half-hearted attempts at being badass over how many bullets you've taken and how many of your homies have been shot dead in the streets over cheap dope?

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

Yeah, taht's exactly what I was saying in my above post! (sorry for the bluntness, read my edit though, I was making a joke. I still should've said it was a joke, though) It's not just rap, though. It's popular music in general. Most of the popular rock groups nowadays are really just crappy garage bands (I won't specify, I already slipped up once). I mean, I believe that if I, at age 13, can play most of their piano stuff, they don't deserve to be popular. And my fried can play the bass stuff, and my other friends the guitar and drums stuff. After that, the ONLY thing left to maybe be "good" at is songwriting. But seriously, some of the lyrics make my ears hurt (there are a couple garage bands with nothing but good lyrics to go on, but I still think that's not worth my money).

It's my favorite fact of life: People are stupid.

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The island bathes in the sun's bright rays
Distant hills wear a shroud of grey
A lonely breeze whispers in the trees
Sole witness to history

ICO-You were there-

I believe it's the current generation. There seem to be more rock/pop/emo fans in today's teen society than hiphop fans, at least in the white society. And rock and rap are so divided that you either like one or the other, at least from what I've noticed at school.

I personally have no problem with it whatsoever. But, if you want to get into technicalities, I guess I'm relaly not listening to it for the actual rap: I like the drumloops and occasional bells that come with it.

Oh, and Spiffyness, what music do you actaully like?

This post has been edited by MathNo.2 on 15th June 2005 05:11

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You know. I think you're a very special unit.

Well, I like rock, that's for sure, but GOOD rock. There are a bunch of really skilled rock bands out there, they're just not very popular, the best by far being Dream Theater. They're Progressive Rock, ABSURDLY good. Then I like Ska. If you don't know, Ska is basically punk rock with a trumpet, trombone, and saxaphone in addition to the usual guitar, bass, keyboard, drums, etc. It's not ALWAYS punk (sometime's it's just normal rock), but it generally is, with a little bit of jazz mixed in. The best band in this category is Five Iron Frenzy, which is a Christian band, but I know a LOT of non-Christians that say they're da bomb.

So... I dunno, I just like good music. I'm a musician, so I like talented music, and I'm a writer, so I like good lyrics. Hard to find both these days...

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The island bathes in the sun's bright rays
Distant hills wear a shroud of grey
A lonely breeze whispers in the trees
Sole witness to history

ICO-You were there-

Haha. I hate rap. Beyond all reason.

I've never liked it. I could never follow the lyrics, and occasionally I thank divine beings that I don't have to. It isn't music. It's people talking fast with an irritating beat in the background whilst slandering the english language. If I wanted to see the dictionary cry I would listen to a Bush speech . Besides that it promotes a culture that, quite simply, irritates the living hell out of me. The videos make me hate it more. It's just guys with goofy gigantic clothes that look like dresses flashing signs with one hand and holding up their pants with the other while women in bikini's dance or sit next to them in cars driving though malibu. Seriously. it's generic rubbish. If rap was wiped off the face of the earth tommorow, I wouldn't shed a single tear.

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If you've been mod-o-fied,
It's an illusion, and you're in-between.
Don't you be tarot-fied,
It's just alot of nothing, so what can it mean?
~Frank Zappa

Sins exist only for people who are on the Way or approaching the Way

I find rap itself to generally being annoying. I don't think it's necessarily the music itself but the culture and people involved in the culture. Most of those I meet that are related to rap culture just come off as stupid and obnoxious. Keep in mind this is not all, but most that I view this way.

As far as women in videos are concerned, in this day and age, hedonism is (unfortunately) a big part in our society. Sex, hot bods, and nudity (or almost nudity) is among the biggest things in any given form of entertainment. I cannot list any movie released within the last 5 years, that I've seen, that didn't have some love (or related) story in it. Basically what I'm trying to say is, it isn't easy to not be perverted, regardless of sexual preference.

As far as rap goes, I am a huge fan of rock music from the '60's and '70's on up. I also like bits and pieces of country as well as classical, christian/gospel, and jazz. I'm not a fan of rap music for the same reasons that I am not a fan of polka. It just isn't my type of music.

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"Thought I was dead, eh? Not until I fulfill my dream!"
Seifer Almasy


"The most important part of the story is the ending."
Secret Window


"Peace is but a shadow of death."
Kuja

You're absolutely right. It's like they say, "Sex sells." Although I will have to dissagree that a love story doesn't fall under that category. You can have a love story without a sex scene, inuendos, or nudity and it would still be a good movie. Heck, the gratuitous sex actually CHEAPENS the movie if you ask me. I mean, if the characters in the story have sex as part of the PLOT, that's fine. Just let us, as the audience, kow about it WITHOUGH actually having a "sex scene" and it's a lot easier than it sounds. They just put it in there to sell more. It's the same thing with gratuitous violence and gratuitous profanityh, it's not necessary at all.

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The island bathes in the sun's bright rays
Distant hills wear a shroud of grey
A lonely breeze whispers in the trees
Sole witness to history

ICO-You were there-

You say you don't like the culture associated with rap. Well, I'd say more than 75% of the rap listeners are...black. So what are you saying? Is it that you just don't like the messages and clothing and whatnot promoted by rap? Or do you not like blacks? Or what? I'm not accusing you of racism, I'm just curious. That makes you and MG that have said the same thing about the "cultural" part of it.

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You know. I think you're a very special unit.

Well I'd say most statistics are made up on the spot, A.
B) the culture I am refering to is the "gangster" culture. The one influenced by 7 out of 10 black children growing up without fathers to serve as positive male role models. And no. I did not make that statistic up. If black culture is crime and gang shootings, then i guess I'm racist. Or, we can look at all people as humans with the choices to follow whatever beliefs they wish.

Edit- However, glorifying the aforementioned culture is hardly a proactive way to solve the problem. Especially when it's complete hypocrasy given that rappers whom you hear on the radio are probably rich and don't live in slums.

This post has been edited by MogMaster on 15th June 2005 21:10

--------------------

If you've been mod-o-fied,
It's an illusion, and you're in-between.
Don't you be tarot-fied,
It's just alot of nothing, so what can it mean?
~Frank Zappa

Sins exist only for people who are on the Way or approaching the Way

Quote (Malevolence @ 14th June 2005 16:28)

i've always wondered, why is rap music bashed by people?

i mean, they say they objectify the women in their videos. well, those woemn wanted to be invideos, so they obviously knew what it would mean. the lyrics cause people to comit violent acts? anyone who can be influenced by the music doesn't need to be allowed in public in the first place. if i made a rap song aboput climbing a mountain, would you go hiking? you just plain don't understand it? well, i don't get punk rock, or emo rock, or whatever the media's callin it.

so please tell me, why don't you like rap? if you like, post your theories anyway.

Rap music is bashed because of the culture more than the genre. Rap artists are, by and large, part of a violent criminal underworld. Their music--the lyrics and the music videos--encourage violence, drug abuse, and the degradation of women and homosexuals, among other things. It's hard not to criticize a genre of music that promotes a lifestyle that leaves hundreds of predominately black men dead or in jail. Is all rap music like this? No. But there are enough artists within the genre who fit the bill to warrant the criticism.

I personally don't like rap music for two reasons: I hate the lyrics, and bass gives me headaches.

I'm trying to find a nice way to deal with what you said about the objectification of women in rap videos, but I can't. I'll just end here.

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Veni, vidi, dormivi.

Quote (MogMaster @ 15th June 2005 16:07)

Well I'd say most statistics are made up on the spot, A.
the culture I am refering to is the "gangster" culture. The one influenced by 7 out of 10 black children growing up without fathers to serve as positive male role models. And no. I did not make that statistic up. If black culture is crime and gang shootings, then i guess I'm racist. Or, we can look at all people as humans with the choices to follow whatever beliefs they wish.

Edit- However, glorifying the aforementioned culture is hardly a proactive way to solve the problem. Especially when it's complete hypocrasy given that rappers whom you hear on the radio are probably rich and don't live in slums.

Yeah, I did make up that figure, but I'd say it's pretty damn close to being right. I agree with what you say about glorifying the gangster culture. If anything, it fuels it, you're right.

And I was not saying that all black people are gangsters who go around shooting people. I was trying to understand what you guys meant by your posts.

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You know. I think you're a very special unit.

Quote (MathNo.2 @ 15th June 2005 15:32)

You say you don't like the culture associated with rap. Well, I'd say more than 75% of the rap listeners are...black.

This is not true at all. Studies have shown that the good majority of rap and hip-hop sells in white suburbs. They've practically eaten up the culture that comes with the music, which in most a lot of cases is marketed right at the bored, middle-class white kid.

I wish everyone who's been bashing hip-hop would open their mind for 42 minutes, long enough to listen to Common's new album, Be. 10 tracks, all different styles, brilliant music in the background. There's no way to get any one song on this album confused with another one. If you want to take the time to download just one song, try "Real People." I can almost assure you your perception of hip-hop will change.

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Hip-Hop QOTW:

"Yeah, where I'ma start it at, look I'ma part of that
Downtown Philly where it's realer than a heart attack
It wasn't really that ill until the start of crack
Now it's a body caught every night on the Almanac"

"Game Theory"
The Roots

so true. if you think rap is nuthin but gangstas and thugs, pick up a Common or Atmosphere album.

also, i'm tired of being called a "poser" or people syain that i'm "actin black". wtf does that even mean?

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moé in the streets, senpai in the sheets

On a happier HipHop related note, I just picked up The Herbaliser - Take London LP on NinjaTune, this is Hiphop, and UK at that.

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Whether you take the doughnut hole as a blank space or as an entity unto itself is a purely metaphysical question and does not affect the taste of the doughnut one bit.

http://slightly-bitter.blog.co.uk

i tried listening to some UK rap once. some group called The Streets. i only made it halfway through the song.

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moé in the streets, senpai in the sheets

Quote (Gears @ 16th June 2005 15:46)

I wish everyone who's been bashing hip-hop would open their mind for 42 minutes, long enough to listen to Common's new album, Be. 10 tracks, all different styles, brilliant music in the background. There's no way to get any one song on this album confused with another one. If you want to take the time to download just one song, try "Real People." I can almost assure you your perception of hip-hop will change.

Well then...

"Whatchu expect from one who smoke a joint with his mother
Anointed hustlers in a fatherless region
Through the pain wish they know that God was just teachin'
We want decent homes"

First verse. The typical "Man, the streets be tough, holmes. Pity us! " rap deus ex machina #4. Use of drugs and poverty, cries for things to get better.

"I wonder is the spirits of Bob Marley and Haile Selassie
Watch me as the cops be tryna and pop and lock me
They cocky, plus they mentality is Nazi
The way they treat blacks I wanna snap like paparazzi"

And now, like the objectification of women, the token potshot at authority every generic rap song must feature. Unexpectedly, it's directed at the police. Well, ok. That was expected.

"Can a dude break free and still get honored at home
I was told by a chief it's the games nature
When you're glowin' some will love and some will hate ya"

Of course, every "poor black dude trying to get ahead in life" rap song features some line about making it big and being above everyone else.

"Black men walking wit white girls on they arms
I be mad at em as if I know they moms
Told to go beyond the surface, a person's a person
When we lessen our women our condition seems to worsen"

Woah. Objectification and an actual spiel about how it's bad? Finally this song actually diverts from the typical rap song. At least in one regard.

Only three references to drugs though: "one who smoke a joint with his mother", "They say the dope game is sour", "Through the purple haze I circle days". Not bad, you'd expect a lot more.

See, no matter how "good" this genre gets, it always, ALWAYS turns out being a rehash of the same material. Money. Drugs. "Da streets yo!" Poverty. Success. Gangs. Fights. Women. Casting down authority (especially the police...) Find me a rap song that strays from this and that doesn't feature drugs, sex, or money in any way, and I'll be impressed. Not only because such a song exists, but because it isn't so obscure as to be unheard of.

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

Quote (Silverlance @ 16th June 2005 20:09)

See, no matter how "good" this genre gets, it always, ALWAYS turns out being a rehash of the same material. Money. Drugs. "Da streets yo!" Poverty. Success. Gangs. Fights. Women. Casting down authority (especially the police...) Find me a rap song that strays from this and that doesn't feature drugs, sex, or money in any way, and I'll be impressed. Not only because such a song exists, but because it isn't so obscure as to be unheard of.

"Tennessee" by Arrested Development. It was a pretty successful song, and while it does talk about poverty,a search for black identity, and a "poor black dude" trying to find his way in life, I see no reason why it shouldn't. "Speech," the rapper, put a lot of thought into his words, and a lot of soul into his voice.

Because What All The Artist Talk About Is Sex

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[img=http://img178.echo.cx/img178/1456/mycard48tc.png]

Quote (MetroidMorphBall @ 16th June 2005 21:19)

Quote (Silverlance @ 16th June 2005 20:09)

See, no matter how "good" this genre gets, it always, ALWAYS turns out being a rehash of the same material. Money. Drugs. "Da streets yo!" Poverty. Success. Gangs. Fights. Women. Casting down authority (especially the police...) Find me a rap song that strays from this and that doesn't feature drugs, sex, or money in any way, and I'll be impressed. Not only because such a song exists, but because it isn't so obscure as to be unheard of.

"Tennessee" by Arrested Development. It was a pretty successful song, and while it does talk about poverty,a search for black identity, and a "poor black dude" trying to find his way in life, I see no reason why it shouldn't. "Speech," the rapper, put a lot of thought into his words, and a lot of soul into his voice.

But that IS a rehash of one, in fact more than one, of the themes I mentionned. ...Or was that the point you were trying to make? I can't say I follow too well.

While I'm not saying these themes can't combine to form good lyrics, it's like having every RPG center around a young knight trying to save a princess or other royal figure from either a dragon, an evil wizard, or another knight gone evil. It's been done, it worked before, but you can only go through so many plot hooks before every game begins looking and sounding the same to all but the die-hard fans. Meanwhile all other genres evolve and diversify themselves, yet our theoretical RPG genre continues to have the same themes. Either the young knight with everything to prove is trying to save the princess from the dragon in order to marry her, some evil knight betrays the crown and abducts the king, an evil wizard abducts the princess and her young knight lover sets out to save her-... heck, even after three of these it gets repetitive, I won't go on.

To the average, non-die-hard fan, this isn't how something should work out. Rehashing the same material over and over is like eating pizza everyday: it quickly loses its taste and you grow tired of it. And believe me, after 6 months of non-stop pizza-chowin' action at the food court at the mall near where I work, I really can't say pizza's very appealing to me anymore no matter what kind of topping goes on it.

Edit: Typo mayhem. Late-night programming sessions always take their toll on me at the end of the week.

This post has been edited by Silverlance on 17th June 2005 03:10

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."

Quote (Silverlance @ 16th June 2005 22:08)

But that IS a rehash of one, in fact more than one, of the themes I mentionned. ...Or was that the point you were trying to make? I can't say I follow too well.

The point I was trying to make is that even though it mentions these things, there is no reason it shouldn't. The rapper I told you about is rapping about his life, about his experiences and his emotions, about, IMHO, something meaningful. He also "doesn't feature drugs, sex, or money in any way." Look up the lyrics, listen to the song. Maybe you'll be "impressed," maybe you won't, but at least you'll have given it a chance.

Also, are you the one who passed out drunk in a field and talked to a bum the next morning? If that was you, then give "Mr. Wendel" a listen too. Same act, same album. Another atypical rap song that you might appreciate, though watch out, it does mention "poverty" and "the police."

Quote (Silverlance @ 16th June 2005 22:08)

While I'm not saying these themes can't combine to form good lyrics, it's like having every RPG center around a young knight trying to save a princess or other royal figure from either a dragon, an evil wizard, or another knight gone evil. It's been done, it worked before, but you can only go through so many plot hooks before every game begins looking and sounding the same to all but the die-hard fans.

I find it ironic that you used this as an example because, IIRC, you are the one who complained about Final Fantasy being nothing more than a label b/c the series strayed from wizards, castles, and a medieval setting.

How many pop songs are about "love?" How many rock songs are about rebellious anger or nihilistic angst? Themes have been reused and recycled in all forms of art and entertainment for centuries. Rarely is anything completely original. I admit hip hop is getting repetitive lately, and that's one reason I'm losing interest in a genre I once found innovative. But I think you're making broad generalizations without digging very deeply.

Quote (MetroidMorphBall @ 16th June 2005 22:31)

I find it ironic that you used this as an example because, IIRC, you are the one who complained about Final Fantasy being nothing more than a label b/c the series strayed from wizards, castles, and a medieval setting.

Never did say I felt it should continue either, though. ;) For the record, I always thought Square should've stopped at 5 and moved on with something new for 6 and up (though I loved 6; appreciation's not the point I'm trying to make here.)

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But I think you're making broad generalizations without digging very deeply.

Well, in that case, prove me wrong. I'm not trying to point at people and say, "Haha, I'm right and you're wrong. :D Your genre sucks and you can't deny it! :D" I'm just expressing my views. Though it IS a generalisation, I've yet to honestly find any rap songs that stray from this.

If you want something to pick at, I'm into german rock. ;) Favorite bands being Rammstein, Eisbrecher, and Megaherz. And I'd have to be a hypocrite not to admit that these bands DO stick to anger and angst, though they express it through many vastly varying themes, and even stray from these base themes often enough. Kopfschuss is about success that transcends even death. Hurrah - Wir Leben Noch conveys the general message, "Life doesn't such, stop whining and be proud of being alive." Schon Geliebt is a song asking wether you've yet lived today or merely let yourself waste away (the general message being more of a "damn man, just get out there and live life to its fullest" thing.) Rock me Amadeus is pretty much in the same veine as Kopfschuss. Fanatica is about dancing, and the overwhelming hypnotic urge to keep going at it (though that one has more of a semi-techno beat to it.)

'Course, on the other hand, Du Hast (if you haven't heard of this song, you must've been living under a rock :P) is about hate and broken promises. Engel is about how the person singing rejects being an angel when he'll die. Schizophren is abou having double-standards, portraying it as schizophrenia. And a fair deal of Megaherz songs take children's stories and pervert them into violent parodies (Rappunzel, where the hero is actually out to slaughter her. I.M. Rumpelstilskin, which focuses on Rumpelstilstskin's cruel position of power over whatever that girl's name was. Hanschenklein, too.) But like I said, there are plenty of songs straying from what one would expect of this genre; just upholding my opinion. ;)

Find me a rap song that doesn't deal at all with the themes people have been bringing up in this thread as cliché, and I'll be downright impressed. You'd probably be shutting up a lot of people who've posted negative feelings towards rap, too. So it's your call... ;) Peace.

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"Judge not a man by his thoughts and words, but by
the quality and quantity of liquor in his possession
and the likelyhood of him sharing."