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Wait, where are you getting the idea that they wandered around teh world from? Hojo's report states that none of them left. Plus, it would make sense for Hojo to keep them on a tight leash so he could observe them. Otherwise, Cloud and Zack couldn't have "escaped" a prison that didn't exist.

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Quote (bahamut0013 @ 29th March 2005 16:00)

Wait, where are you getting the idea that they wandered around teh world from? Hojo's report states that none of them left. Plus, it would make sense for Hojo to keep them on a tight leash so he could observe them. Otherwise, Cloud and Zack couldn't have "escaped" a prison that didn't exist.

There's the numbered man in the Midgar tube that disappears, the clones that appear in Nibelheim (they weren't there originally), and like...dude, they wander, trust me. That's how they all end up at the reunion. Hopefully SoS can verify that, or correct me if I'm wrong.

Quote (KefkaLives @ 29th March 2005 18:48)

Quote (bahamut0013 @ 29th March 2005 16:00)

Wait, where are you getting the idea that they wandered around teh world from? Hojo's report states that none of them left. Plus, it would make sense for Hojo to keep them on a tight leash so he could observe them. Otherwise, Cloud and Zack couldn't have "escaped" a prison that didn't exist.

There's the numbered man in the Midgar tube that disappears, the clones that appear in Nibelheim (they weren't there originally), and like...dude, they wander, trust me. That's how they all end up at the reunion. Hopefully SoS can verify that, or correct me if I'm wrong.

They do wander, yeah. There's the fellow in the pipe in Midgar, the one that appears at the Temple of the Ancients and dies, [what was probably] one at the Gold Saucer, and those that travel all the way to the Northern Crater. Considering that they all started out in Nibelheim, I'd say that's a damn good bit of wandering.

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My Final Fantasy VII Plot Analysis

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" — Edmund Burke

what i am not sure about sepiroth was super strong lvl50 if i remember and cloud was weak lvl 1 and he manage to throw sepiroth off bridge and have supposed to kill him but later when he didn't know what his true past he meets sepiroth and sepiroth didn't kill him.

Quote (TJH @ 30th March 2005 03:18)

what i am not sure about sepiroth was super strong lvl50 if i remember and cloud was weak lvl 1 and he manage to throw sepiroth off bridge and have supposed to kill him but later when he didn't know what his true past he meets sepiroth and sepiroth didn't kill him.

Well granted that Cloud was a weak Level 1 while Sephiroth was uber-powerful but I guess the reason he was able to withstand the stab wound from Sephiroth and throw him off the bridge was the extreme emotional state Cloud was in after seeing his mother die and Tifa nearly dead. That would throw a person into such a state of adrenilne that they would have much more strength and determination then usual.

Your other point about why Sephiroth didn't kill him later, I can only guess cause it was not the true Sephiroth, but one of the clones that Hojo created cause remember the real Sephiroth was still inside the crater waiting for the black materia. That is my guess.

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I'm reviving this to add to the discussion that took place on the last page. It would seem that Shin-Ra determined that Cloud was unfit to enter SOLDIER because they did test his mental fortitude with Mako exposure.

I say this because a college student in Japan has kindly taken it upon theirself to translate Final Fantasy VII: Before Crisis into English. Here is a link to the website: Gunshot Romance.

(Before Crisis Spoilers ahead.)

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Note in Chapter 4 that it is said that the folks who are being rounded up by the Turks as candidates for SOLDIER are going to be exposed to Mako and that only a few of them will actually qualify for admittance into SOLDIER:

Quote

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Prisoner

Let us out of here! What’s the big idea, keeping us in this electric cage!



Player

We’ll be arriving at Midgar soon. Once you’re there, you’ll go through the Mako transfusion process and you’ll become members of SOLDIER too.

...

Player

I didn’t think we’d have to force them. I always thought entry into SOLDIER was voluntary.



Rude

We have to resort to using force sometimes. It’s not something we can do anything about.



Player

Why is that? You and Reno have scouted for SOLDIER before, right? Now that I think about it, the SOLDIER ranks haven’t increased all that much in the last while, have they?



Rude

You have to be strong to enter SOLDIER. Only a handful of those people we’ve gathered will make it into the ranks.

This would suggest that qualification for entry into SOLDIER is based on how one reacts to Mako exposure. That's one more mystery of Final Fantasy VII solved at last... hopefully.

This post has been edited by Squall of SeeD on 5th April 2005 15:38

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My Final Fantasy VII Plot Analysis

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" — Edmund Burke

Heres how I understand things:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Let's go back to Clouds childhood shall we? He was always alone, he wanted to "hang-out" with Tifa and her friends (cool kids) but he was scared of getting rejected. That's when he decided to join SOLDIER so Tifa would notice him. Of course as everyone knows he didn't make it and was just a grunt. He was so ashamed of himself that he didn't even reveal his face when he came home with Sephiroth to investigate the reactor. We all know what happens there...So now Zack and Cloud are being kept in the Nibelheim Mansion and being experimented on. They escape, but Cloud is very, very messed up. From all the mako. This is the turning point in his life. Cloud remembers the stories Zack tells him on the trip to Midgar, and then suggests they become mercenaries. Cloud, in a fragile mental state, confuses his memories with Zack's. On the outskirts of Midgar, Shin-Ran kills Zack and leaves Cloud for dead. Cloud picks up Zack's sword, and he, in a sense, becomes Zack. Now, in the present, Cloud meets Aeris. Since Zack loved Aeris, Cloud was attacted to her. Even though Cloud truly loved Tifa, he couldn't help but love Aeris, when Aeris dies, you can tell Cloud is deeply remorseful. Tifa tried to get closer to him, but never really could get through to him until the Mideel incident. That when the true Cloud finally regained control.

Correct me if I am wrong about anything.

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Quote (Musashi @ 17th April 2005 01:18)

Heres how I understand things:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Let's go back to Clouds childhood shall we? He was always alone, he wanted to "hang-out" with Tifa and her friends (cool kids) but he was scared of getting rejected. That's when he decided to join SOLDIER so Tifa would notice him. Of course as everyone knows he didn't make it and was just a grunt. He was so ashamed of himself that he didn't even reveal his face when he came home with Sephiroth to investigate the reactor. We all know what happens there...So now Zack and Cloud are being kept in the Nibelheim Mansion and being experimented on. They escape, but Cloud is very, very messed up. From all the mako. This is the turning point in his life. Cloud remembers the stories Zack tells him on the trip to Midgar, and then suggests they become mercenaries. Cloud, in a fragile mental state, confuses his memories with Zack's. On the outskirts of Midgar, Shin-Ran kills Zack and leaves Cloud for dead. Cloud picks up Zack's sword, and he, in a sense, becomes Zack. Now, in the present, Cloud meets Aeris. Since Zack loved Aeris, Cloud was attacted to her. Even though Cloud truly loved Tifa, he couldn't help but love Aeris, when Aeris dies, you can tell Cloud is deeply remorseful. Tifa tried to get closer to him, but never really could get through to him until the Mideel incident. That when the true Cloud finally regained control.

Correct me if I am wrong about anything.

Cloud didn't "essentially become Zack," no. He only incorporated those things that Zack had told him about his time in Nibelheim into his own memories, with himself in Zack's place during certain events. He also adopted some of Zack's habitual gestures, as well as his status as a member of SOLDIER. Basically, just things about Zack he had seen or been told about. He didn't adopt things like his feelings for Aerith.

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My Final Fantasy VII Plot Analysis

"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing" — Edmund Burke

I don't think exposure to Zack had anything to do with Cloud liking Aeris. I think that was just a coincidence. I agree with you that he had feelings for her, though, perhaps even love.

I would say it's more likely that Aeris fell for Cloud because of her attachment to Zack. There are a few points in the game where she says Cloud reminds her or is "just like" her "old boyfriend." Plus, Aeris' mom asks Cloud to leave the house so that Aeris won't get hurt again. I think that's a good indication that Aeris was attracted to Cloud because he reminded her of her first boyfriend.

I think Cloud and Tifa make a better couple than Cloud and Aeris. She was too "goody-two shoes" for the bad-ass with the big sword.

This post has been edited by FabulousFreebird on 20th April 2005 00:29

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