Track this topic | Email this topic | Print this topic

I'm not sure how many Angel fans are actually out there; I know that there's me and Tiddles, and that's about it that I know of here. Anyway, I think it's an excellent show. For those who don't know about it, it's a spinoff of Buffy the Vampire Slayer. The main character is a vampire, but cursed with a soul, named Angel. Him and his group live in LA, and fight evil from their base; a lawfirm called Wolf Ram and Hart, that used to be their enemy.

Unfortunately, this great show that's lasted 5 seasons (almost as long as Buffy was, which was 7 seasons) is being cancelled. There's a huge movement to try to keep it going, but I'm not sure if it's actually working. As far as I know, the last episode will be sometime in May.

Angel plays on the WB Wednesday nights at 9 (EST) if anyone wants to check it out before it goes away. I've heard that even just having your tv on on that channel, without watching it, helps with ratings, and that might help the movement.

So, any other Angel fans?

This post has been edited by Elena99 on 3rd May 2004 20:48

--------------------

I had an old signature. Now I've changed it.

Don't forget Mr. Thou and his valiant attempts last year to finish season four on a suspiciously narrow broadband connection.

Yeah, Angel. Aside from the lack of Willow, I personally think it's a whole heap better than Buffy. If you were ever put off Buffy by of that aroma of teen angst that tended to hang around, give Angel a go (while it's still on). Don't just shudder because it's got funny demon people in, and all. The drama's all good, though I'm a little weary of all the nice girls dying.

It's shaping up like it could be a good finale, anyway. In any case, it'll be very sad to see the only TV show I can still be bothered with (aside from the odd soap when they pack enough Cute Girls in) disappear.

Angel is a very good show. It's one of the few that I actually make an attempt to watch. I do think Angel is better overall than Buffy, and Spike coming over made it even better. I heard about the show being cancelled a few weeks ago and already signed the petition. It's dark atmosphere, quirky humor, and surprisingly good acting reeled me in.

As a side note, I found out a couple weeks ago too taht Cordy(Charisma Carpenter) will be posing in playboy. Many people are against it, and understandably many people are fo it. Just thought I would throw that in.

--------------------

"My impersonation of an ordinary person was flawless." - Neal

"Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." - Dr. Seuss

I like Angel and Buffy, but I also enjoy the earlier seasons of both shows more. Despite my affinity for the show, I feel like Angel may have run its course and should bow out gracefully now. I think Buffy ran a few seasons too long, and by the end the writing felt stretched a forced.

PB78

Quote (Pandabear78 @ 3rd May 2004 23:07)

I like Angel and Buffy, but I also enjoy the earlier seasons of both shows more.  Despite my affinity for the show, I feel like Angel may have run its course and should bow out gracefully now.  I think Buffy ran a few seasons too long, and by the end the writing felt stretched a forced.

PB78

Absolutely agreed on the Buffy front. The last two seasons suffered badly, largely due to being altogether too dark and too centred on a bigger arc at the expense of proper character development, to the point where there was little evidence of the characters even being themselves. Its final ever episode, written and directed by series creator Joss Whedon, showed us what we'd been missing in the last couple of seasons, in my opinion.

I don't think the same of Angel, though. I wasn't a big fan of season four (see above criticisms of Buffy S6/S7), and I was wary of the changes this season, but overall I've found it a lot more enjoyable, much in the same way that Buffy's fifth season picked up from an unpopular fourth. Of course, the return of my favourite sometimes-bad guy helped a lot, even if his motivation has been a little unclear. Destiny, You're Welcome, A Hole in the World and Smile Time have to be among the best episodes in the series' history.

But it'd certainly be better to go out on top than to limp through a couple of seasons like Buffy's final two. I just think there's more they could get out of this one before it goes flat.

Quote (Hanyou @ 3rd May 2004 22:36)

As a side note, I found out a couple weeks ago too taht Cordy(Charisma Carpenter) will be posing in playboy.  Many people are against it, and understandably many people are fo it.  Just thought I would throw that in.

I've seen some pictures from that. I was reading the other day that doing it probably scotched her chances of landing a Wonder Woman role, so that has to be irritating. They're quite nice pictures, though. I'd say "tasteful", but that's always a matter of debate. Nothing extreme, anyway.

Funny that after being kicked off the show this year, she's now the only one with a job lined up next year.

I have watched Angle a few times and am totaly lost...probly because i never saw Buffy. Anyone mind explaining the basic premise to me?

--------------------

There is a time and a place for everything, and I am niether

I watched Angel a little bit, and I liked it, but didn't watch enough to say that I "watch the show."

Also... I heard from my sister (who watches the show a lot more than me) that the actor for Angel (why does his name escape me?) had to go up to the executives and plead with them to let the show go on for one more season. Seems like the WB just wanted to axe the show right then and there.

Movements to keep shows going don't generally matter to the corporations behind the programs. Best of luck to the, though.

I own the first four seasons of Buffy on DVD, but I haven't seen much past that, and I haven't watched any Angel yet. I suppose I'll take this thread as a general recommendation to do so.

--------------------

Veni, vidi, dormivi.

My cousins are into Angel, but too bad I'm not.

--------------------

"I must not fear, fear is the mind-killer."
Bene Gesserit Litany

"You will beg for death before the end!"
Boromir of Gondor

Quote (The Gambler @ 4th May 2004 01:51)

I have watched Angle a few times and am totaly lost...probly because i never saw Buffy. Anyone mind explaining the basic premise to me?

The back story leading into the start of the show, largely inherited from Buffy, is that Angel's a vampire who was one of the most hated and feared of his kind in the past, until gypsies cursed him by restoring his soul, forcing him to live with the guilt of everything he'd done without one.

Unfortunately, a moment of "perfect happiness" (as the show puts it) causes him to lose his soul and revert to who he was. This happened once on Buffy. Willow managed to restore it, but only once his plans to destroy the world were far enough advanced that the only way to end them was for Buffy to send him into a vortex to a hell dimension. (Well, it makes more sense if you watched it.)

Anyway, he came back. I missed that bit of Buffy, so I don't know how, but not long after that he decided that he'd only cause Buffy pain if he stayed in Sunnydale, and moved to LA. Begin spin-off.

That still won't help a lot if you tune into a current episode, though. The best way is just to start from season one, episode one, and go from there. The show refers back to itself a lot and tends to have a season-long plot arc or two (or sometimes longer) so it's very difficult to understand anything if you come in in the middle.

You could probably start at the beginning of season two or season five and get away with it though, just about.

And yeah, the campaign to save the show seems to be failing. I'd agree that they don't tend to have much effect, but it worked well enough for Farscape, and this wasn't just fans: UK broadcaster Sky apparently offered to pay some of the cost of a new series if a network would take up the rest, but still noone took it up. Many WB network affiliate broadcasters also supported the campaign. The impression seems to be that a new season is out of the question now, at least for next year, but that the chances of some kind of (TV?) Movie in the future have been increased.

Quote (Tiddles @ 3rd May 2004 23:27)

Don't forget Mr. Thou and his valiant attempts last year to finish season four on a suspiciously narrow broadband connection.

Damn right I'm in : with a max download possible of 15 ko/s, but still...
Anyway, I did get all the 4th season, and then caught up with the 5th, thanks to Tiddles' advice about using BitTorrent instead of Kazaa.

I signed the petition on Angel.org, but apparently it failed. Maybe there's a chance to see Angel on TV again, but I doubt it will be in the format of a TV show.

Anyway, I'm like Tiddles on many levels about Angel : I think the spinoff is very much better than Buffy, more matured so to speak. I like the 1st, 2nd and 3rd season a lot, not so much the 4th, but it's still quite good. The last season has a lot for itself, and it's looking like a good ending for the show that altogether relates a very nice story (the ending has to be great, but I'm confident about that). Overall, Angel has been one of my favourite fantastic show over the last years (I seem to like a lot of shows that get canceled, seeing that I thought that Farscape was a nice show too)

This post has been edited by Mr Thou on 4th May 2004 08:52

I. Love. Angel. And. Buffy.

I started watching Buffy ages ago, and of course when I heard about Angel I leapt at the chance to see cool-ass David Boreanaz. There are a lot of things that need commenting on about them.

1) The lack of Anya, (Emma Caulfield). She's my favourite character, from when she's singing in Once More With Feeling, to her tragic end in the last episode. (God that made me so upset).

2) Cordelia undergoes a big change from Buffy to Angel. In Buffy she's stuck up, snobbish and all, "Ew, a vampire. Gross!" but in Angel, after she starts getting visions, she turns all nice and stuff. Charisma Carpenter rocks!

3) J. August Richards, (think I got that right), as Gunn and Alexis Denisof as Wesley were both good cast members, remembering Wesley from when he starred as Buffy's replacement watcher.

4) The Host rocks. I don't know who plays him, but he's funny.

5) The plots in Buffy can sometimes be childish, (except for all the sex and sexual relationships thrown in, of course). But Angel episodes are for the most part, aimed at a higher audience, well thought out rather than just, "Omg, vamps! Dust 'em and see Buffy and Faith waggle their asses!"

I've heard Spike, (James Marsters) is going to make an appearance in one of the final episodes, although I'm not sure. (Has this happened yet or what? I'm kind of less up to date with Angel than I am with Buffy). Dunno how the hell that would fit in with the Buffy storyline, though.

Anyway, Angel friggin rocks!!!


--------------------

"Luck is my middle name. Mind you, my first name is Bad." - Rincewind

You can be as self-assertive as you like, just so long as you do what you’re told.” - Granny Weatherwax

"When Mr. Safety Catch Is Not On, Mister Crossbow Is Not Your Friend" - Sam Vimes to Detritus

I'm guessing you're stuck in the past watching the UK terrestrial episodes, like I used to be. It's well worth investing some bandwidth in downloading old DVD-rips to catch up, if you have any kind of decent connection buying DVD box sets legitimately to catch up.

Anyway, Spike. Season five spoilers ahead:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

He's a regular in this season. The amulet he used in the final battle was posted to Angel, and he emerged from it as a ghost.

Worse season five spoilers ahead:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

He's recorporealised after receiving a mysterious "box of flash" (maybe it had the latest SBEmail in it? Ho ho ho). It turns out that both the amulet and the box were posted by none other than Lindsey McDonald, who intends to play Spike off against Angel to make a power play at Wolfram and Hart.

It's good. Angel really started picking up steam just when Buffy really started losing it. Joss really has a commitment to his characters and it shows.

--------------------

"That Light has bestowed upon me the greatest black magic!"

go angel, gotta love the show

--------------------

THE LIZARDSSS SHALL EATSSS YOU

buffy the vampire slayer was the greatest show until the last season, the characters were awsome, willow was the coolest low self esteem witch, anya the ex-demon-still-adjusting-to-living-life-as-a-human, buffy the dumb blonde that has to save the world "again?! how many apocalypses has this been?", xander funny but useless, rupert giles ahaha just his name is funny, spike was/is argueably the coolest vampire ever. but, they should have just ended it in the season with that evil 'god' Glory

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

you know the season in which buffy dies

but what can ya do.. angel, a good show but it doesn't have the sheer comedy that buffy did, and it didn't have spike, but now that spike is a regular on angel they end the show! *wimper*
BTW has anyone seen the movie buffy the vampire slayer? made in the 80's. VERY different then the show...

--------------------

And when the band you're in starts playing different tunes,
i'll see you on the dark side of the moon.... - Pink Floyd

Eagle may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines

Well thought I'd revive the thread as a farewell. Is anyone else kinda pissed? I can equate my feelings about the last episode to something like a case of blue balls.

--------------------

"That Light has bestowed upon me the greatest black magic!"

I spaced out and forgot it was on...bad Hanyou, but I did catch the last 15 minutes or so. I thought it wasn't that bad.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Would you have prefered to actually see them all die? Watching Wesley die was more than enough for me, and I think they did a damn good job in the way they handled it.

Now to find someone that recorded it, so I can catch what I missed.

--------------------

"My impersonation of an ordinary person was flawless." - Neal

"Don't cry because it's over. Smile because it happened." - Dr. Seuss

if push comes to shove and you can't find anyone who taped it don't worry you can either catch it in reruns or if you are really patient you could rent the last season on DVD....

--------------------

And when the band you're in starts playing different tunes,
i'll see you on the dark side of the moon.... - Pink Floyd

Eagle may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines

You can find it on the Electric Internet if you missed it. I've also heard it's being repeated in next week's Angel timeslot.

I'll add my thoughts on the finale later today, after I've obtained it.

Okay, so I've seen the final episode

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

..if you can call it that. Judging from how it ended, it looks as though Whedon at least didn't intend for this to be a finale, and hopes that he can continue it in the fall, or at least some time in the future. In a way I like that, because as a writer, he KNOWS that it's not over, and he didn't comprimise the show by ending it prematurely.

But he also did kill Wesley, and Lindsey, and Lorne wants nothing more to do with Angel. So I'm not sure what it would go back to. Oh, and Hamilton is dead, and Harmony quit.

So it looks like it's over, and yet it's not.

I enjoyed the episode overall, though I'm still not sure about that ending. Angel says something about wanting to fight the dragon, they start to move forward towards the hordes of monsters, and then...screen goes black, credits.

This post has been edited by Elena99 on 20th May 2004 15:54

--------------------

I had an old signature. Now I've changed it.

Fantastic episode. Perhaps it seems inconclusive, but that's Angel. I don't think a Buffy-style ending would be right at all.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Tons of fantastic scenes. Pretty much all of them, in fact, including Connor; perhaps this season's most remarkable achievement is that I no longer want him to die. All the Lindsey scenes were brilliant. If the show were ever coming back, I'd be upset with his fate, but it's fitting for the character. And Wesley's death was emotional and pointless, like everything that seemed to happen to the poor guy. He didn't have much to live for anyway.

I'd heard some great things were in the pipeline for next year, which makes me doubly cross that it's all over. But they're the cards that've been dealt, I suppose; it's a vastly better ending than if it'd finished post-Season 4, anyway.

I hope everyone enjoyed the comedy of the "Thanks From Your Friends at the WB" thing after the end, or wanted to punch the TV in at least. Silly, silly WB. I will now hate you forever.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Ok, I liked the episode and all. And I know Joss Whedon's style on this show and everything, but missing sooo much of the action was such a letdown. Gunn says "You guys shoulda seen me, I was on fire." Yeah no kidding, I would have loved to watch him to take on and dust 20 vamps. And forget the dragon, what the hell was that big tank looking thing at the back of the demon horde?!?! Oh well...I guess it was good episode, i'm just so depressed that it's over. *sobs"

--------------------

"That Light has bestowed upon me the greatest black magic!"

OK, time for my little say.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

First, I feel like Elena on this ending : it looks like this would have been the season 5 finale, no matter what. It definitely has the taste of a season finale, not a serie finale.
Overral, the episode is great : greatly shot, with nice amount of action and acting. It fits nicely with the rest of the season, wich I loved : it was way better than the 4th, a little reminiscent of the first season (plus, it's the only one with the first one that has an appearance of Doyle in it. We miss you, mate).
I think we can wait for a continuation, probably in a mini serie. There's definitely enough material for it, the Shanshuu prophecy being the strongest one. I feel bad though, seeing that an hypothetical continuation would happen without Wesley Windham Pryce : he is by far my favourite character of the whole show, being the one that evolved the most during the 5 seasons. I do feel a little like Tiddles one his death : it's pointless, and very emotionnal. I don't believe he deserved it, but it's a romanesc conclusion for his journey.

I join Tiddles one more time for my last feeling about the matter (and I'll expand it even) : I hate you, damn networks. Already you deprived me of fantastic shows, like Profit, Brimstone or Farscape (I've seen the finale on Tuesday...sad week it is). Seems like it's not ending after all : every year brings its disapointment with itself.

the girl i like is a fanitic about angel. she talks about it all the time but i dont really know what shes saying. i guess it must be a good show to attract that kind of following.

--------------------

Disasterchild8 brought me to this site! Rock On Sean!

Ashes To Ashes, Gascans And Matches.
Mushroomhead

I thought it was a fitting ending. I would get mad if they tried bringing it back.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

"We'll last ten minutes, at best."
- Fred
Let that be true. I mean, do you really expect them to survive that horde?

I completely expected Connor's final appearance, though I did think he would be the one to

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

kill Hamilton.

I agree with Tiddles that Wesley's

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

death was fitting for his character.

At least Spike got to deny Angel three times XD

Lindsey has been Angel's enemy for the longest time.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Ironic how it was Angel's "lackee", as he called him, who would be the one to off him. I guess the point of that was not the lesser of two evils, but get rid of all the evil you can when you can.

It left alot open - Connor, Harmony, Lorn, Eve, Buffy; but isn't leaving very little closure truly the best kind of closure?

--------------------

"I had to write four novels before they let me write comic books."
-Brad Meltzer

Quote (Dark Paladin)

I thought it was a fitting ending. I would get mad if they tried bringing it back.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

"We'll last ten minutes, at best."
- Fred
Let that be true. I mean, do you really expect them to survive that horde?

Well, you really ought to attribute that to Illyria. And what she actually says is:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

"You're fading. You'll last ten minutes at best" to Gunn, who is clearly leaking his insides all over the floor.

The thing is, they were going to do the same thing for a continuation to S6 (more or less; they would have been "less brutal", I read in an interview) so it's not inescapable. After all,

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

how was Angel going to face all the otherworldly nasties he was faced with at the end of 4.20 "Sacrifice"? That all turned out alright.

The fun thing about Whedon's universe is that anything can happen, and it usually does.

Quote (Dark Paladin)

Lindsey has been Angel's enemy for the longest time.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Ironic how it was Angel's "lackee", as he called him, who would be the one to off him. I guess the point of that was not the lesser of two evils, but get rid of all the evil you can when you can.

Yeah, that's probably right. Still, it seemed pretty harsh that:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Harmony, who did betray Angel, got to walk away with a recommendation when Lindsey, who did his job, got a couple of bullets in the chest. I wonder if he really was turning over a new leaf; he did offer to sing for Lorne, after all. I think it was Christian Kane himself who said in an interview something along the lines of, well, if anyone had just ASKED Lindsey to be on the team maybe he would have been all along. I'm not sure about that, but there's probably something in it.

Quote (Dark Paladin)

It left alot open - Connor, Harmony, Lorne, Eve, Buffy; but isn't leaving very little closure truly the best kind of closure?

In Eve's case:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

I'm imagining that she did a Shadow, and sat in the crumbling building awaiting her death: she gave up everything for Lindsey and lost him anyway, so what did she have left? For someone who was pretty unpopular at the start of the season, I probably felt the worst for her (and Lindsey; did you see the look on his face as he died?) at the end.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Wesley goes down? Confound it all!

There's usually a two-year buffer at the very least between the American shows and what they show in te Netherlands, over here,

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

Cordelia just gave birth to...something goddess-like, although I'm not sure that she's trustworthy.

At any rate, what the point of this post is:

Wesley experienced an incredible (and believable) character development from day 1 we saw him and to the point of the shows I see here (and I can only guess how much he changes after that). Next to Angel he still seems the "kid" from time to time, but he became pretty stinking cool.

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

If have no idea how he died and if it was a dramtic sacrifice from his side or just plain a bad guys' sword trough his stomach, but I always pictured him at the very end of the last episode, sitting in some pub, unshaven and doing that thing that he often does/did, which is blaming himself for whatever he couldn't do (saving another Angel character, the love of his life or something like that). Bearing some kind of permanent physical mark (be it a scar, or an eyepatch, or a limp in his walk), he would walk into the foggy streets of whereever he is, closing the marvelous show that was Angel.

This post has been edited by Elena99 on 22nd May 2004 18:12

--------------------

The Collapse of Heaven and Earth

Wow. Just because you chose to read the spoilers doesn't mean that you should announce what they say out loud. You might want to edit that.

--------------------

"That Light has bestowed upon me the greatest black magic!"

I apologize, didn't think about it. Elena beat me to it anyway, so it's been all Spoilered nicely.

--------------------

The Collapse of Heaven and Earth