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One multiplayer game whose multiplayer community I've actually enjoyed is 100% Orange Juice. There's a lot of skill involved in decision-making, but also a lot of luck involved in the outcomes of those decisions. And it's probably because the RNG can (not) be counted on to horribly wreck anyone's plans, even those made by the most experienced players, I think it inspires a decent sense of humility among its playerbase.

On the other hand, if you have stuff that's very skill-based (such as, apparently, Counter-Strike: Global Offensive, from what I can tell), you get an unfortunate number of people who are experienced/skilled at the game purposely taking advantage of their skill to establish themselves high in the player hierarchy and thereby create an atmosphere that's unfriendly to new players, and also high-tension even among established players. It's not exactly a surprise that when games keep obvious stats that seem to reflect a player's skill, people will use those stats to judge each other, and people have to go to the extent of creating new accounts to practice or experiment just to avoid letting themselves look bad in their stats. It also incentivizes cheating, which is a serious problem that negatively affects both the honest players AND the developers.

This post has been edited by Glenn Magus Harvey on 7th December 2015 22:27

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Check the "What games are you playing at the moment?" thread for updates on what I've been playing.

You can find me on the Fediverse! I use Mastodon, where I am @[email protected] ( https://sakurajima.moe/@glennmagusharvey )

The My Documents folder would be much more pleasant to look at and use if games didn't send their save data to the root of it, instead of the more appropriate My Games or Saved Games. And I'm saying this as someone who isn't really interest in saving my data to the cloud.

Oh, and please don't save the save files (Freedom...) into the root of the game's exe (...Planet!), as this prevents having as many files as possible per user.

Also, when giving me a level editor, do include a MAP for the level in question. Its a pain having to load an external tool just to see how I structured the level's map.

Skype should have an in-game overlay. Microsoft needs to do this on at least Windows 10.

If I bought the physical copy of a game, please don't put ONLINE DRM on it! I went to a store and bought the box just so I could avoid all this mess. Plastering an idiotic Steam logo on the box just means that the box is simply no better than the downloadable copy, and therefore, not worthy of a purchase. Bonus points if the box included NONE of the game's files, just the DRM's installer.

Oh, what if you released a multiplatform game on both Android and PC, and your Android version was DRM-free but your PC version was DRM'd? How pointless. Its easier for me to download the DRM-free Android port and run it on an Android emulator on the PC than deal with the DRM.

On the subject of Android, I hate when people say that touchscreens are not great input methods or the likes when it comes to PC or console games. Touchscreens have two things over keyboards and mice and joysticks, is that they are EXTREMELY CUSTOMIZABLE, and they offer a lot more than just tapping the screen. Tomb Raider is on touchscreens already. GTA San Andreas also saw touchscreens. Clever touchscreen input would involve utilizing swipes and slides and taps to the fullest; for instance, slide the B button up to do an uppercut instead of B+Up, or slide the C button to the left to raise a shield to the left. The complaints regarding touchscreens simply exist because they are underutilized, is all.

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I am Exdeath. Step aside pesky clowns, or your warranty is Void!

My opinion on Everquest I have a love hate relationship with the game.Sometimes I absolutely adore camping and other times it's such a chore to spend 5 hours a day for a week to get one item I want.Sometimes it takes months or years to get one drop because the mob spawns once a week and you have to roll with random strangers and never quite get the upgrade you need.sometimes I simply prefer instances, and other times I adore Everquest.I have a strange relationship with wow too, as the quest system seems meaningless to me.It didn't have that epic feel that Everquest had where you had to raid to get a certain item to even get one of the items required for that quest, and it took forever.

On the other hand I feel bitter because when eq was at its largest, there were a lot of elitist jerks who made the game worse, and ruin the game for everyone.The game did get better once the community got smaller and they got a lot nicer.Actually p99 has some of the nicest folks I've met.I a, kind of spoiled by wow though with the instances and being able to solo and not deal with having to spend half an our of frustration to get my corpse because of one stupid mistake.

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We are stardust.Our bodies are made from the guts of exploding stars.

Neil Degrasse Tyson.

I honestly think Zelda games suck.

I hate anything Call of Duty.

I think most mobile games (95% +) are pure garbage.

I miss instruction booklets and 4 disc sets.



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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

Uh huh so you hate all the good ones too? alright opinions opinions whatever np.

Call of duty sucks it's repetitive run around shoot the same guys online your grouped with ad nauseum till a new game version comes out with better graphics and listen to 12 year olds call you the n word or make some sort of homophobic comment, which is what 12 year olds and 10 year olds sound like.Oh yeah you also hear hate speech towards Mexicans too.I have seen some trolling on cod and humiliation and that is what they sound like.

I do miss CDs though and booklets.I got the a artwork for a game called bioshock 2 years ago when I bought the game.Its really nice and I miss that.When you buy off steam, you don't get the booklets or any info, just the game burned into your pic Xbox one or PS3 or ps4 or 360.

By the way:I think I prefer Xbox 360 over PS3.I haven't had nearly as many problems as with PS3.Today my controller won't charge and the controller I just bought second hand with the cable, and is. Blue tooth.I am beyond frustrated, because I was having fun with assasins creed 1 and I can't play mass effect trilogy cd.I don't know if it's the console or the cable.With Xbox I like how you can insert the battery and it works fine.With PS3 I have tons of problems, plus a few busted controllers.On top of that, at times the PS3 freezes or I have to restart to detect the high def cable to get the best graphics and each time it freezes I have to wait for a million billion years plus:Each time I want to see my trophies I have to load.With Xbox 360 I can see my trophies instantly and never ever had problems with hdmi cable or having as many freezes as PS3 and the controls are a lot more durable.

This post has been edited by Magitek_slayer on 16th January 2016 10:24

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We are stardust.Our bodies are made from the guts of exploding stars.

Neil Degrasse Tyson.

Silent Hill 4 is a good game.

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Metal gear solid 4 is a very good game and i like most of what hideo kojima makes.I even liked metal gear solid 2, even though 3 is my favorite.

I liked world of warcraft pvp during wrath of the litch king even though it really sucks now due to balance issues.

I am getting ps4 even though i said i wouldn't buy new consoles, because why not?

I tend to think pc games are slightly better due to mods.Skyrim on pc is buggier but so many mods to download to make your game fun, and even having not beaten the game yet, i have completed most quests.

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We are stardust.Our bodies are made from the guts of exploding stars.

Neil Degrasse Tyson.

I think Final Fantasy 8 was a pretty good game. sure it handles some things weirdly but I think it gave us contrast to, at the least, help us appreciate what the other games brought to the table.

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He's Back. He is The_TrueBOSS.
Check me and my partners out at: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheTrueBOSSofJupiter

ZELDA GAMES ARE ALL THE SAME AND OVER-RATED

there! I said it!

Okami and Shadow of the Colossus are better.

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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 30th January 2017 15:45)

ZELDA GAMES ARE ALL THE SAME AND OVER-RATED

there! I said it!

Okami and Shadow of the Colossus are better.

Are you referring to the latest generation Zelda titles because LoZ 1 and Link to the Past are different enough from each other. I personally didn't care for it but Zelda 2 was a total departure from what you think of a Zelda game.

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kame, tortue, tortuga, schildkröte, tartaruga, turtle

"Arthur Dent?"
"Yes."
"Arthur Philip Dent?"
"Yes."
"You're a total knee biter."

Firstly, whatever. Twilight Princess was the last good Zelda game.
(I haven't played Link between worlds)

Skyward sword made me want to stab my eyes.

Majora's Mask is an exquisite work of art, potentially my favourite game of all time, if you don't like it, or don't "get" it; it's simply too good for you. Simple as.

Now to the real issue.
Magitek's Dark Souls thread was a complete trainwreck, so here comes the defence brigade.
The ignorant responses were somehow even worse.

Quote (Spooniest)

It looks like Diablo in full 3-D with more advanced play mechanics

I dunno...it seems like everyone says it's too hard, that's all I keep hearing.

I think I'll stick to Contra.

Lol WHAT are you smoking!?
Also Contra is way harder in terms of sheer twitch skill. It kicks my ass.

The OVERWHELMING majority of individual challenges a player will face in Dark Souls are beatable on the first attempt. The genuinely unfair moments? Mimic chests, that's about it.
Got killed by an arrow trap? maybe you should've noticed the obvious pressure plate on the floor.

Capra Demon is fine, you just need the right strategy.
Is it hard? yes.
can you do the right thing first time? yes.
You can beat it with a lucky swing at the beginning of the fight.

Summoning and Co-op ruins the balance of the game entirely.
Summoning for a boss removes all challenge. Only scrubs summon.
Using ranged magic is.. mostly scrubtown too.

Sure, some people overhype the difficulty, but why waste your time responding to memes not actually thrown on this forum and let it colour your opinion of the game.

Magitek said he had to look controls up on google. What?
The tutorial area at the beginning tells you all the controls..

Dork Souls is amazing.
Git gud.

tl;dr the saltiest fanboy rage post of my life.
I'm a bit ashamed.

This post has been edited by Blinge Odonata on 31st January 2017 20:54

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 31st January 2017 14:43)

The OVERWHELMING majority of individual challenges a player will face in Dark Souls are beatable on the first attempt. The genuinely unfair moments? Mimic chests, that's about it.
Got killed by an arrow trap? maybe you should've noticed the obvious pressure plate on the floor.

Capra Demon is fine, you just need the right strategy.
Is it hard? yes.
can you do the right thing first time? yes.
You can beat it with a lucky swing at the beginning of the fight.

Summoning and Co-op ruins the balance of the game entirely.
Summoning for a boss removes all challenge. Only scrubs summon.
Using ranged magic is.. mostly scrubtown too.

Sure, some people overhype the difficulty, but why waste your time responding to memes not actually thrown on this forum and let it colour your opinion of the game.

Magitek said he had to look controls up on google. What?
The tutorial area at the beginning tells you all the controls..

Dork Souls is amazing.
Git gud.

It's attitudes of the Dark Souls player base like these that make me never want to play Dark Souls.

And you should totally play A Link Between Worlds. It's probably one of my top three of the entire series.

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this is a blog mostly about comics and videogames
END SPOILER

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 31st January 2017 14:43)

Firstly, whatever. Twilight Princess was the last good Zelda game.
(I haven't played Link between worlds)

Skyward sword made me want to stab my eyes.

Majora's Mask is an exquisite work of art, potentially my favourite game of all time, if you don't like it, or don't "get" it; it's simply too good for you. Simple as.

I always heard that Ocarina was better than Majora's, and I only ever played Ocarina for an extended period of time between the two. Never owned an N64 and never liked Zelda games.

I will say this though, I did thoroughly enjoy the Wind Waker and Oracle of Seasons/Ages.

But I stand by my statement that they're vastly over-rated and basically the same game over and over. Doesn't mean they aren't good games.

You want to talk about "exquisite work of art" then look no further than Okami and Shadow of the Colossus. Two "Zelda clones" that, imo, are far more charming, immersive, rewarding and engaging.

Quote (Kame @ 31st January 2017 00:41)

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 30th January 2017 15:45)

ZELDA GAMES ARE ALL THE SAME AND OVER-RATED

there! I said it!

Okami and Shadow of the Colossus are better.

Are you referring to the latest generation Zelda titles because LoZ 1 and Link to the Past are different enough from each other. I personally didn't care for it but Zelda 2 was a total departure from what you think of a Zelda game.

Zelda 2 is about the only one different from the others in the main series. LTtP is literally just a 16-bit remake of the original game though.

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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

Quote (laszlow @ 1st February 2017 02:36)

It's attitudes of the Dark Souls player base like these that make me never want to play Dark Souls. 

And you should totally play A Link Between Worlds.  It's probably one of my top three of the entire series.

Yeah?
You're one of the few people on this forum I wouldn't say "fine, you're not worthy anyway"

I blew up because people were negging on the game when quite literally not knowing what they're talking about.
But sure, walk away from a franchise because I posted an aggressive response.

why should I listen to your recommendation now?

Wait, DT.. did you just call SoTC a Zelda clone?
LOL
Nothing you say will ever have any merit again.

No wonder you arrive at statements like X is the same as Y if you equate SoTC (a game I love) To zelda. Jesus christ, i don't know where such reductionist thinking comes from.


This post has been edited by Blinge Odonata on 1st February 2017 07:43

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 31st January 2017 14:43)

Quote (Spooniest)

It looks like Diablo in full 3-D with more advanced play mechanics

I dunno...it seems like everyone says it's too hard, that's all I keep hearing.

I think I'll stick to Contra.

Lol WHAT are you smoking!?
Also Contra is way harder in terms of sheer twitch skill. It kicks my ass.

The OVERWHELMING majority of individual challenges a player will face in Dark Souls are beatable on the first attempt. The genuinely unfair moments? Mimic chests, that's about it.
Got killed by an arrow trap? maybe you should've noticed the obvious pressure plate on the floor.

Capra Demon is fine, you just need the right strategy.
Is it hard? yes.
can you do the right thing first time? yes.
You can beat it with a lucky swing at the beginning of the fight.

Summoning and Co-op ruins the balance of the game entirely.
Summoning for a boss removes all challenge. Only scrubs summon.
Using ranged magic is.. mostly scrubtown too.

Sure, some people overhype the difficulty, but why waste your time responding to memes not actually thrown on this forum and let it colour your opinion of the game.

(Looks behind himself to the left)

(Looks behind himself to the right)

...What me?

Huh?????? You're yelling at me?



Uhm. You don't really think that someone who'd played Dark Souls would have posted such a thing would you? I would have thought the fact that I hadn't actually played it, and did not thus know anything about it, was inherent in the statement "Looks like," which was present in the post I made.

...You have a more stressful life than I do, which makes me feel bad. Are you getting enough to eat? Are you warm enough? Your water & electric on?

EDIT: To get us back on topic, I will state a new unpopular gaming opinion that I have

The Games Industry grew out of the Gambling Industry which was not always legal and has had a history of being very unpleasant to its customers to be honest with you. I wish gaming could be as good-natured as the atmospheres of the games it was releasing when I was a kid (1985-2000 is the period I'm sort of thinking of). Really, I've realized since then that I'm basically at a very advanced card table the moment I click on an RPG, but there's a certain "magic" to it that is taken away from by the unpleasant nature of the industry itself, which I now can see in the games I have from that era, sort of peeking through the cracks, you might say.

Why does gaming have to be such a mean business...goodness.

Makes the music industry seem civil by comparison at times, grumble grumble, Goriya wants a meat bone

This post has been edited by Spooniest on 1st February 2017 12:42

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X is blue.

Quote (Spooniest @ 1st February 2017 12:25)

Quote (Spooniest)

It looks like Diablo in full 3-D with more advanced play mechanics

I dunno...it seems like everyone says it's too hard, that's all I keep hearing.

I think I'll stick to Contra.

Huh?????? You're yelling at me?

...You have a more stressful life than I do, which makes me feel bad. Are you getting enough to eat? Are you warm enough? Your water & electric on?

Only the first bit is to you specifcally, spooniest.

and no! wheres my damn eletric!?

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 1st February 2017 02:36)

Quote (laszlow @ 1st February 2017 02:36)

It's attitudes of the Dark Souls player base like these that make me never want to play Dark Souls. 

And you should totally play A Link Between Worlds.  It's probably one of my top three of the entire series.

Yeah?
You're one of the few people on this forum I wouldn't say "fine, you're not worthy anyway"

I blew up because people were negging on the game when quite literally not knowing what they're talking about.
But sure, walk away from a franchise because I posted an aggressive response.

why should I listen to your recommendation now?

It's not one aggressive response. I played Demon's Souls (didn't finish it) and thought it was pretty good. My understanding of Dark Souls was that it's an open-world version of Demon's Souls with several basic gameplay improvements and a much more interesting story. I have no doubt that it's good.

My hesitation comes from its fanbase. I don't like it when anyone says there's a right or wrong way to play an open-world game, or that "scrub" strategies make you less of a player that someone who plays the "right" way. That kind of language rubs me the wrong way A LOT, and the Dark Souls fandom seems to be rife with it.

Plus, my backlog is insane, and I have dozens of other games to play. Don't need to add Dark Souls to the queue, even though I'm sure it's excellent.

And unrelated: LOL at the idea that ALTTP is a wholesale 16-bit version of the original. Spoken like a true Zelda hater that's played neither.

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this is a blog mostly about comics and videogames
END SPOILER

Yeah my post was a bit scorched earth, i'll give you that.

However part of those douche opinions about summoning being scrubbish is in fitting with the thread's theme tbh.

The souls community usually throw the scrub term at people who are already part of that community though, instead of outsiders.

Objectively I think a souls first timer can play as they please.
Subjectively summoning+magic suck git gud. ;]

Anyway Souls isn't "open world"
The term "linear branching" is okay. Think of it as a 3D metroid in terms of how you progress through the world.
To illustrate this some more, while you can go in 3/4 directions at the beginning, there's really only one path. The other paths will destroy newbies, and are better left to NG+ or experienced players.

The idea is you get squashed instantly first time, then maybe you'd better try another way.
There's a documented phenomenon of people starting the game, not finding the route to the de facto first area, and permanently giving up.

Actually, i will defend this point to the grave:
Co-op destroys the games' balance and makes 90% of bosses a complete joke.
It's not Monster Hunter: Souls is designed and balanced to be single player first and foremost.

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Quote (laszlow @ 1st February 2017 12:42)

LOL at the idea that ALTTP is a wholesale 16-bit version of the original. Spoken like a true Zelda hater that's played neither.

I can see why some people think that; it basically is meant to appear a souped-up version of the original (top down perspective is back, overworld theme is identical in arrangement to the NES with new instruments, 8 levels with artifacts you collect, etc), but it really is so much more than that.

LoZ 1 never had a musician boy who was frolicked around by the forest creatures (skittish of Link) get warped to the Dark World and turn into a mindless mouthless tree for all eternity. That's some heavy stuff man. You even end up reporting his fate to his father, and adopting his pet bird.

That's...heavy, compared to "PRINCE DARKNESS GANNON WANTED THE TRIFORCE WITH POWER" and so forth.

Also "Stop Having Fun Guys" bother me about all online gaming, that is why I refuse to play games online. Too many "busybodies."

This post has been edited by Spooniest on 2nd February 2017 01:06

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X is blue.

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 1st February 2017 02:36)

Wait, DT.. did you just call SoTC a Zelda clone?
LOL
Nothing you say will ever have any merit again. 

No wonder you arrive at statements like X is the same as Y if you equate SoTC (a game I love) To zelda. Jesus christ, i don't know where such reductionist thinking comes from.

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist, Zelda-esque Action/Adventure game with role playing elements; It doesn't rely on voice acting, nor elaborate cut-scenes for it's story-telling.

The "protagonist" carries a sword, rides a horse and is rescuing a princess/love interest. He also has a bow & arrows, fights epic bosses, and roams an open world.

Yeah they don't sound all that similar now that you mention it.

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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

I'm often reminded, when foruming, of how my dad used to tell me that you don't have to be a dumb person to get into a bitter argument with people. Astrophysicists who go out drinking together are known to get in knock-down-drag-out brawls over the gravitational constants of Quarks, and such.

Really kind of raises the hairs on the back of my neck when people are so polemic, as my girlfriend likes to call me, often.

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X is blue.

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 2nd February 2017 01:25)

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist, Zelda-esque Action/Adventure game with role playing elements; It doesn't rely on voice acting, nor elaborate cut-scenes for it's story-telling.

The "protagonist" carries a sword, rides a horse and is rescuing a princess/love interest. He also has a bow & arrows, fights epic bosses, and roams an open world.

Yeah they don't sound all that similar now that you mention it.

Even if all those comparisons were true you have to be super reductionist to arrive at "sotc is a zelda clone." There's no point to such statements.

Okay so lets begin.

Quote

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist

Zelda series is not minimalist.

Quote

Zelda-esque Action/Adventure game

Oh so if you call it zelda-esque you must be instantly right!

Quote

role playing elements

What role playing elements? Seriously, what.
The fact that you can increase your health bar?
And don't be that retarded guy who says: cuz u play a role duh!

Quote

It doesn't rely on voice acting, nor elaborate cut-scenes for it's story-telling

SoTC begins with cutscenes and several minutes of expository dialogue, all voiced.
The rest of the plot is given to us by further scenes with the chief guy arriving.
Yes, there are mysterious elements of the world and story not told to the player at all,
but guess what series is not known for such obscure elements? Zelda.

Zelda series *actually* has no voice acting in current releases; leaves nothing to the imagination and uses wayy more dialogue and cutscenes than SotC does throughout the game.

Quote

The "protagonist" carries a sword,

Uhh.. they are protagonists?

Yeah a sword used in completely different ways.
Link slashes things, Wander can't swing the thing properly and uses it almost exclusively for stabbing.

Quote

rides a horse

Horse riding in Zelda is an afterthought.
In SotC it's a fundamental part of the gameplay, especially in combat.
Also Agro is a character unto himself, and a good one at that.

Quote

and is rescuing a princess/love interest.

Mono, the girl in SoTC isn't a princess, and her relationship to Wander isn't stated.
He isn't rescuing her but trying to bring her back to life, for unstated reasons.

Also zelda isn't a love interest for most of the series, nor is she always the object of the game.
Come to think of it, Zelda spends most of the series only getting captured and needing a rescue at the very end of the games..
This is true of:
OoT, (absent from majora& link's awakening), WW, TP, SS- i think.
Oh and zelda flies around as your ghost buddy in Spirit Tracks (don't get me started).

Quote

He also has a bow & arrows

oh DAMN MAN YOU GOT ME.

Quote

fights epic bosses

SoTC's bosses are epic on a scale Zelda games only dreamed of before.
They're also the entire meat of the game, not just a challenge to cap off a dungeon and make sure you use that new item you picked up.

>dungeon
huh.. remember when Wander went into a huge dungeon? full of enemies and puzzles, sometimes other characters?
he must do right, cause it's a zelda clone...

Also, Twilight Princess was released after SotC and suddenly has huge more epic bosses that link had to ride and try to stab like Wander!
In lame QTE segments that were vastly inferior to SotC's gameplay.
So.. zelda is now trying to rip off the clone it apparently spawned, what?

Quote

and roams an open world

Wander can instantly go to 95% of the Forbidden Land. In one sense the world is far more open than zelda's worlds.
On the other hand the game's pretty much linear, and there's no progression in the game at all unless you fight the colossi in their intended order. The sword even points and tells you where to go.

Link cannot explore all the "open world" at a whim, it must be unlocked throughout the course of the game. This is true of every zeldo since the original game.
However in some games progression can be made in different areas at once, out of sequence.

So to reiterate:
Sotc - can go anywhere instantly. must follow linear progression
zelda series - cannot go everywhere, world is less open/more linear. But progression is actually less linear.

Really, DT; the devil's in the details.

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Blinge has good points, Dyna.

I know as much about Shadow of the Colossus as an egoraptor video can teach, so I won't visit my lack of knowledge about it on y'all, but I wanted to say what is meant by 'reductionist thinking' because I don't feel that's been clearly communicated, though Blinge I think did mention the term.

'Reductionist Thinking' is where you try to analyze things down to the smallest possible detail, break it all down to its simplistic elements, get scientific, use that Occam's Razor and stuff.

The inherent mistake, or fallacy, that reductionist thinking is prone to, is, put in the vernacular, "missing the big picture," or "tunnel vision," or "not being able to see the forest for the trees."

Zelda is much more engaging to a person's sense of communication than SotC, and SotC is far more experimental as a game. Clone, it is not.

SotC is like if someone said "Let's make a Zelda-type game that is totally unrelated to any culture that has ever existed in any way [you might not know this but Zelda is based around Christianity, they were gonna make it more obvious but Nintendo of America said no], and plays way differently too [Zelda was based on Adventure, an Atari cartridge, SotC is based on something called "Ico," right?]." The other people in the room then looked back at him blankly for a couple seconds, and responded "Oh...uh...well...ok boss, what system are we programming for again?"

It is experimental in a way that 80's Adventure Games could not have been, sheerly by virtue of the time in which it was made, and who it was made by, and the budget they had to work with. The two are separated by time and design philosophies of quite different ages indeed.

Being too reductionist in your thinking tends to root you in your already known personal opinions and preconceived notions...you lose the ability to be open to other angles on things.

This post has been edited by Spooniest on 2nd February 2017 13:41

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X is blue.

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 2nd February 2017 04:06)

Quote

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist

Zelda series is not minimalist.

You lost your argument here because of your clear lack of reading comprehension.

And not at all because of your name calling, and ignorant reaction to a guy who posted in a thread called UNPOPULAR GAMING OPINIONS THAT YOU HAVE.


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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

Quote (Spooniest @ 2nd February 2017 08:37)

Blinge has good points, Dyna.

I know as much about Shadow of the Colossus as an egoraptor video can teach, so I won't visit my lack of knowledge about it on y'all, but I wanted to say what is meant by 'reductionist thinking' because I don't feel that's been clearly communicated, though Blinge I think did mention the term.

'Reductionist Thinking' is where you try to analyze things down to the smallest possible detail, break it all down to its simplistic elements, get scientific, use that Occam's Razor and stuff.

The inherent mistake, or fallacy, that reductionist thinking is prone to, is, put in the vernacular, "missing the big picture," or "tunnel vision," or "not being able to see the forest for the trees."

Zelda is much more engaging to a person's sense of communication than SotC, and SotC is far more experimental as a game. Clone, it is not.

SotC is like if someone said "Let's make a Zelda-type game that is totally unrelated to any culture that has ever existed in any way [you might not know this but Zelda is based around Christianity, they were gonna make it more obvious but Nintendo of America said no], and plays way differently too [Zelda was based on Adventure, an Atari cartridge, SotC is based on something called "Ico," right?]." The other people in the room then looked back at him blankly for a couple seconds, and responded "Oh...uh...well...ok boss, what system are we programming for again?"

It is experimental in a way that 80's Adventure Games could not have been, sheerly by virtue of the time in which it was made, and who it was made by, and the budget they had to work with. The two are separated by time and design philosophies of quite different ages indeed.

Being too reductionist in your thinking tends to root you in your already known personal opinions and preconceived notions...you lose the ability to be open to other angles on things.

Eh. I don't know how you can come in trying to be a part of the discussion, or at this point attack on me by Blinge, having never actually played (or as you say "knowing nothing" of it) Shadow of the Colossus. I specifically placed air quotes around "Zelda-Clone" for a reason. FFS people. Not to mention this entire post actually backs me up while making Blinge look like the overreacting fool he or she is and not just toward me.

And Blinge's reading comprehension leaves a lot to be desired.


Search some google is you don't think they're similar games. I don't know what to tell you.

Next I'll hear Beyond Good and Evil isn't at all like Zelda.


This post has been edited by Dynamic Threads on 2nd February 2017 21:32

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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 2nd February 2017 21:16)

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 2nd February 2017 04:06)

Quote

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist

Zelda series is not minimalist.

You lost your argument here because of your clear lack of reading comprehension.

That's not comprehension fail dude, I'm just pointing out yet another difference between the two.
Y'know, to show that SotC isn't a clone..
It's not a particularly hard point to understand.

I can't lose an argument when this weaksauce response and "muh opinions!" is your best comeback

Also, it's too late to fall back on "zelda clone" with quote marks, seeing as you already tried to defend the term like you believe it's correct.

Also I haven't called you any names. I should, but i haven't.

OMG BOTH LINK AND WANDER HAVE LONG HAIR. COINCIDENCE!? I THINK NOT

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

If the forums were busier I would have closed this thread by now.

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"To create something great, you need the means to make a lot of really bad crap." - Kevin Kelly

Why aren't you shopping AmaCoN?

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 2nd February 2017 17:14)

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 2nd February 2017 21:16)

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 2nd February 2017 04:06)

Quote

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist

Zelda series is not minimalist.

You lost your argument here because of your clear lack of reading comprehension.

That's not comprehension fail dude, I'm just pointing out yet another difference between the two.
Y'know, to show that SotC isn't a clone..
It's not a particularly hard point to understand.

I can't lose an argument when this weaksauce response and "muh opinions!" is your best comeback

Also, it's too late to fall back on "zelda clone" with quote marks, seeing as you already tried to defend the term like you believe it's correct.

Also I haven't called you any names. I should, but i haven't.

OMG BOTH LINK AND WANDER HAVE LONG HAIR. COINCIDENCE!? I THINK NOT

Don't expect people to respond to you in the future when you come up with a rhetoric that's based off of bad reading comprehension. It's pretty simple. You completely mis-interpreted everything I said and then chose to spin it in your favour.

And people are throwing logical fallacy and reductionist thinking at me.

It's laughable.

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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 2nd February 2017 01:25)

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist, Zelda-esque Action/Adventure game with role playing elements; It doesn't rely on voice acting, nor elaborate cut-scenes for it's story-telling.

The "protagonist" carries a sword, rides a horse and is rescuing a princess/love interest. He also has a bow & arrows, fights epic bosses, and roams an open world.

Yeah they don't sound all that similar now that you mention it.

So what is there to misinterpret about this? Looks pretty straightforward to me.

Your face saving techniques are better than your opinions; you must have ample opportunity to practice.

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www.youtube.com/blinje
The victor sacrificed the vanquished to the heavens

Quote (Blinge Odonata @ 3rd February 2017 03:21)

Quote (Dynamic Threads @ 2nd February 2017 01:25)

Shadow of the Colossus is a minimalist, Zelda-esque Action/Adventure game with role playing elements; It doesn't rely on voice acting, nor elaborate cut-scenes for it's story-telling.

The "protagonist" carries a sword, rides a horse and is rescuing a princess/love interest. He also has a bow & arrows, fights epic bosses, and roams an open world.

Yeah they don't sound all that similar now that you mention it.

So what is there to misinterpret about this? Looks pretty straightforward to me.

Your face saving techniques are better than your opinions; you must have ample opportunity to practice.

I'm not trying to save face and I'm not going to sit here and pick apart your posts. It's an opinion thread. Not a teach someone how to better comprehend what they read thread.

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Dynamic Threads (Youtube)