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Quote (Endymion)

As far as Time Compression is concerned, I think it's simple: It's a large-scale spell.

And the point of casting it? No, seriously - what's the purpose?

Quote (ZidaneTribal)

Why is the orphanage plotwist so bad of a plotwist ?

It's not the plot twist itself, because gathering a party of heroes who happen to have been raised in the same orphanage is an idea that quite appeals to me, but it would have been much better executed by gathering the party one-by-one, several "do I know you?" moments and at least one lampshade hanging.

The two things that make this plot twist a failure are:
1) Edea having brought them up. Gets additional "Wait-what?!" points for her being Cid's wife.

2) GFs make you forget. No, seriously, what the hell? The fact that they didn't recognize/remember each other isn't impossible to explain by real-life means, and it doesn't need artificial amnesia at all. Also, even this might've worked if it was a gameplay element - negative EXP for summoning GFs, for example. This would've worked both towards gameplay balancing and storyline credibility, but I think they decided that keeping no sense in the plot and making the player overpowered is a good idea.

Also, the love story is quite absurd. Rinoa is in love with Seifer at first, and this is believable - jerks seem to be quite popular. As for Squall, he's emotionally distant and quite uninteresting a character at the beginning. What happens then? Suddenly Rinoa is all over him, like Chocobos over Kupo nuts. No reason given, no resolution of the relationship between her and Seifer.
Nothing.

Also, I can't remember if I already mentioned this, but there is one theory that makes the game make more sense to me.
Squall dies at the end of disc 1, after he has been pierced with that ice spike, and everything that goes on after that plays out in his subconcious and can be seen as a dying wish-fulfillment fantasy.
Here's the theory if anyone wants to read it.

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"I fell off the mountain of words at around the 10,000ft mark. Tell my family...they owe me money." -Narratorway

"If you retort against this, so help me God I'll shove any part of your anatomy I can find into some other part. Figuratively, of course." - Josh

"We have more, can deliver tuesday." - Del S

Good old CoN

Quote (SilverMaduin)

Quote (Endymion)

As far as Time Compression is concerned, I think it's simple: It's a large-scale spell.

And the point of casting it? No, seriously - what's the purpose?

So far as I'm aware, Ultimecia wanted to rule time and space, so what she was trying to do was compress time into one eternal moment - from which she would create her own reality that she controlled.

As far as the GF thing... the point was that there seemed to be no negative repercussions to using GFs - to SeeD and Balamb Garden, who used the Paramagic developed by Dr. Odine. And then, when it finally came out that the Abilities the GFs developed were taking up the long-term memory of the party, they had no choice but to continue using the Junctions. That's the point of it, to me. The old line, "You don't know what you've got, till it's gone."

As far as Rinoa/Seifer/Squall... I'll admit it seems somewhat outrageous at first, but I'd say that it's more likely that Squall was falling for her first without understanding how or why; she provoked emotion from him in a way no other person could. Plus, she saw the other side to him - and noticed that when the time came, unlike Seifer (who basically did a love 'em and leave 'em on her), Squall stood up and fought to save her life. Seifer was already under Edea/Ultimecia's control as her Knight by the time Rinoa's Sorceress powers emerged; and it wasn't like he was trying to switch sides, either.

This post has been edited by Endymion on 8th December 2010 22:15

I like how in this day and age there are still people whining over a game that was made 11-12 years ago. If you don't like it, don't play it. If you don't like the attention it gets, don't bring it up -- you are no better if you do. As much as I don't care for Final Fantasy VIII (and Final Fantasy in general), I could still see myself playing it. It's not *that* bad, when compared to a plethora of horrid NES games (and the NES is my second favorite console... how about that?). Sure, this game had its faults and all that stupid bullshit but whining about it isn't going to solve anything -- you can't change anyone but yourself. Most people in the Final Fantasy community, as I have noticed, have the IQ of a twig and need to get laid (BIG time) because taking the time to sit down on that fancy chair while listening to trendy indie rock music and drinking crappy energy drinks as they bitch about an old game is about as productive as beating a dead horse. Move on.

This post has been edited by Allen Hunter on 8th December 2010 23:01

Quote (Allen Hunter @ 8th December 2010 18:00)

I like how in this day and age there are still people whining over a game that was made 11-12 years ago. If you don't like it, don't play it. If you don't like the attention it gets, don't bring it up -- you are no better if you do. As much as I don't care for Final Fantasy VIII (and Final Fantasy in general), I could still see myself playing it. It's not *that* bad, when compared to a plethora of horrid NES games (and the NES is my second favorite console... how about that?). Sure, this game had its faults and all that stupid bullshit but whining about it isn't going to solve anything -- you can't change anyone but yourself. Most people in the Final Fantasy community, as I have noticed, have the IQ of a twig and need to get laid (BIG time) because taking the time to sit down on that fancy chair while listening to trendy indie rock music and drinking crappy energy drinks as they bitch about an old game is about as productive as beating a dead horse. Move on.

I like how in this day and age there are still people whining about people whining over a game that was made 11-12 years ago. If you don't like it, don't respond to it. If you don't like the attention it gets, don't respond to it -- you are no better if you do. As much as I don't care for people coming in to troll (and Allen Hunter in general), I could still see myself trolling them. It's not *that* bad, when compared to a plethora of other horrid posts (and Allen Hunter's horrid posts are my second favorite... how about that?). Sure, this post had its faults and all that stupid bullshit but whining about people whining about it isn't going to solve anything -- you can't change anyone but yourself. Most people who come to a Final Fantasy community to troll, as I have noticed, have the IQ of a twig and need to get laid (BIG time) because taking the time to sit down on that fancy chair while creating an absolutely horrible series of useless websites and putting hovercats into a post as they complain about people bitching about an old game is about as productive as beating a dead horse. Move on and stop posting here.

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"To create something great, you need the means to make a lot of really bad crap." - Kevin Kelly

Why aren't you shopping AmaCoN?

That's beautiful man.

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Arts

Farts

Twarts

R51, FTW!

That's the great thing about CoN - FF fans of all generations can get together and complain in peace and harmony as a community.

This may not be the "perfect" place for it, but you know what? It's as good as any. Thanks, man.

Back to FFVIII!

Yes, it's a decade old game. FFVII is older, you still see new releases in that storyline. They released FFIV - The After Years for Wii. FFIII sold very well on DS. And they're been talking about rereleasing FFVII. Hopefully they'll be making one for the black sheep that makes the story a little easier for people.

Quote (Tiddles @ 20th November 2010 11:09)

Quote (ZidaneTribal @ 20th November 2010 08:10)

What about Cecil coming from the moon from FF IV ?
Galuf coming from another world and using meteors as transportation ?
Terra being half human- half fantasy creature ?
Tidus not being real and actually being a dream ?

None of these things involve the mighty level of coincidence (sorry, "destiny") that the orphanage reunion does. And yes, of course it was planned, but that doesn't mean it was adequately foreshadowed so as not to feel utterly bizarre (unless you read latin maybe). It's the combination of these factors, and quite possibly others I've forgotten.

I agree with Tiddles; my biggest problem with the "GFs make your memory go bye-bye" deal is that, up until that point, the game treates the Guardian Forces as nothing more than a gameplay mechanic. The only mention of them at all is either to remind you to junction before going into battle or "rumors" that a GF lives in [insert dungeon name here]. The player is given no reason to think that GFs are relevant to the story in any way, shape, or form.
In regards to ZT's post, in every other FF game I can think of/have played where the gameplay is relevant to the story, it's explained relatively early on:
VI: Magicite is what's left after an esper dies, and it can teach magic to whomever it is equipped to. Kefka slaughters espers to get magicite 'cuz he's a douche.
V: The shards of the shattered crystals contain the essences of various classes of fighters, which the Light Warriors can utilize to save the world(s).
III (despite having no real story to speak of [yes, I include the DS version in that statement]): See above, except the crystals aren't shattered or anything.
With that said, I thought Cecil being from the moon was bullcrap.

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EGG TOSS
YOU CARRY
EAT A BAG
LEMON-DY
HEAD SAUCE
JIM CARREY
IN A BEAR
HEAVEN PEE
DAFFY-ROTH
- brentalfloss

seifer is the only good part of the entire game

Wasn't there a mention at some early point in the game about the GF Amnesia thing? I think:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

A Garden faculty after you pass the SeeD test says "Be sure to ignore all the GF criticism you hear from other Gardens or
military forces."

It's not much but it does hint at something.

You know, VIII has weaknesses just like any/all other games in the series. I like VIII a lot; some people do and some people don't. I really have ceased to care whether people like it or not, and if you don't agree with me, that's fine--just don't expect me to talk about it with you.

Quote (Cefca @ 27th January 2011 22:35)

Wasn't there a mention at some early point in the game about the GF Amnesia thing? I think:

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

A Garden faculty after you pass the SeeD test says "Be sure to ignore all the GF criticism you hear from other Gardens or
military forces."

It's not much but it does hint at something.

Yeah, see, stuffing a vital plot point into a throwaway line as well as optional in-game encyclopaedia entries, is what we call "bad writing". You don't hide foreshadowing, you make it seem obvious at the time or in retrospect, and barely anything foreshadows the scenes bar a handful of things that don't even seem obvious in retrospect and could just as easily be connected to different events.

Maybe actually HEARING some of that criticism from less optional voices would have helped. But no. One line, and a couple of databank logs.



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"Only the dead have seen the end of their quotes being misattributed to Plato."
-George Santayana

"The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here..."
-Abraham Lincoln, prior to the discovery of Irony.

Quote (rouge @ 27th January 2011 19:11)

seifer is the only good part of the entire game

How so? He's an ass. He's not even an ass you can manage to feel sorry for (for instance, Prince Zuko in the first book of Avatar: The Last Airbender, even though he comes around).

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EGG TOSS
YOU CARRY
EAT A BAG
LEMON-DY
HEAD SAUCE
JIM CARREY
IN A BEAR
HEAVEN PEE
DAFFY-ROTH
- brentalfloss

Because he's a good villain, with an interesting, complex motivation, which is unique in this game. There's also the rather subtle development as a villain that is more noticable on replays.

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I fear my heart and fear my soul
Life goes on, it surely will,
Without me and I wonder:
Will I ever see light again?

Life goes on...

Quote (Insegredious @ 30th January 2011 22:03)

Quote (rouge @ 27th January 2011 19:11)

seifer is the only good part of the entire game

How so? He's an ass. He's not even an ass you can manage to feel sorry for (for instance, Prince Zuko in the first book of Avatar: The Last Airbender, even though he comes around).

A villain doesn't have to have redeemable factors to be a good villain. Perfect example: Heath Ledger's Joker.

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Praise Be To Helix!

Quote (BlitzSage @ 31st January 2011 04:51)

Quote (Insegredious @ 30th January 2011 22:03)

Quote (rouge @ 27th January 2011 19:11)

seifer is the only good part of the entire game

How so? He's an ass. He's not even an ass you can manage to feel sorry for (for instance, Prince Zuko in the first book of Avatar: The Last Airbender, even though he comes around).

A villain doesn't have to have redeemable factors to be a good villain. Perfect example: Heath Ledger's Joker.

That's actually a very good example; I hadn't thought of that, although to use my own example, Princess Azula (pre-nervous breakdown) could count.

But for me, Seifer was just...bleh.

This post has been edited by Insegredious on 31st January 2011 05:44

--------------------

EGG TOSS
YOU CARRY
EAT A BAG
LEMON-DY
HEAD SAUCE
JIM CARREY
IN A BEAR
HEAVEN PEE
DAFFY-ROTH
- brentalfloss

To tell you the truth,i could relate more to squall than i could to cloud.Strange since i generally don't like the story or the gameplay much.I found that squall seemed very nervous and lacks self confidence.I can relate to him lacking self confidence because i too lack self confidence.Squall also seems to not be good at dealing with people and generally seems a bit cold and to move ahead.He by definition is a loner and seems to not be good with dealing with people,he even tells that i think to quistis.Another thing he seems very nervous about being leader because he truly wants to give it 100%.I too can relate to this as when i have been made an op in a room because my friends truly like me,i immediately become enthusiastic and want to give it 150% I also was once made a try out mod in a online game called called cowed and i stood still thinking immediately what i wanted to do and became nervous because i didn't know where to start and what i wanted to do to help the community.

I also feel that quistis is like a tutor figure to him who guides him and feels close to him.At the beginning she is the only person he seems to open up to,but later on he opens up.

Quote

blitzsage

A villain doesn't have to have redeemable factors to be a good villain. Perfect example: Heath Ledger's Joker.

I feel that one of the jokers strong points is he had a sort of crazy attitude without being over melodramatic and not trying to be over explained and rationalize his reasons.

I feel that over victimizing a villain and trying to dramaticize it can lead to a over melodramatic villain story and ends up not being good at all.I feel sephiroth did this because he had a sad story.I felt like i could forgive kuja because he was generally more interesting and even though he was rather girly,i felt that he was trying to be evil and was rather an jerk when he killed queen brahne and tried to destroy the world and wanted to take out his anger on the world.
I also don't think that brahne was so bad as a villain either even if she wasn't the main villain.She was everything that depicted a selfish cruel act.She was greedy selfish mean ugly fat loud and obnoxious.Seymour was a bit weird as a villain and had a creepy vibe to him.I had to investigate him more because i'm not 100% informed on his story,but he was kind of weird and something seemed fanatical almost about him.Hojo was definitely evil and underrated in comparison to sephiroth.I feel that some people look past him because he wasn't the main villain when he certainly is responsible for the main villain becoming who he was.



This post has been edited by Magitek_slayer on 31st January 2011 12:05

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We are stardust.Our bodies are made from the guts of exploding stars.

Neil Degrasse Tyson.