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Not exactly the same question as last time. It's a bit more refined.

In general, people seem to either love or hate this game. Anyone want to help me understand why?

And so my topic doesn't get closed this time, I haven't completed the game yet. Currently I

Possible spoilers: highlight to view

just got Cloud back from discovering his past in the Lifestream. I haven't started on the underwater huge materia yet.

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How are you today?

i wouldn't say people either like it or hate it. a better term, from what i've heard, would be: people either think it's a good game or sacrifice their soul to the altar of FFVII by completing multiple 100+ hour playthroughs and dressing up like cloud for halloween.

that said, i like the game. it's got a deep plot, and a lot of stuff is going to get thrown at you pretty quickly bunny, if i recall. of course, the lifestream bit is pretty big too. the characters are great to get along with. straight out, its a fun game to play. not too dificult, not too confusing. however, in my opinion, it's not the best game in the series, and it's not the best game of all time.

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I agree with what DP has said. Nobody really hates it, you just come across people who enjoy slating it to make them look retro. In reality this is one of the best in the series and one of the best games out. Many more people would agree with me before the compilation - which puts Cloud in a different light. FFVIII gets more abuse, but I assume you've not played it yet?

From your position in the game you've got lots left to enjoy!

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Scepticism, that dry rot of the intellect, had not left one entire idea in his mind.

Me on the Starcraft.

Quote (sweetdude @ 5th December 2007 06:24)

I agree with what DP has said. Nobody really hates it, you just come across people who enjoy slating it to make them look retro. In reality this is one of the best in the series and one of the best games out. Many more people would agree with me before the compilation - which puts Cloud in a different light. FFVIII gets more abuse, but I assume you've not played it yet?

From your position in the game you've got lots left to enjoy!

I disagree. I disliked the game very, very much. I could give a damn if that makes me look trendy or retro or whatever.

It was something new for the times when it came out. It had tons of content, and was a breath of fresh air for millions of gamers. I can understand how it became such a beloved game. Personally, I never got into it. I didn't find it fun, I didn't enjoy the plot, and I didn't like the materia itemization (my position on this has softened over the years, though I'm still not a huge fan).

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I thought is was okay

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The plot was paper thin compared to any other FF4+ game
The characters might as well be card board cut outs when it comes to personality depth and development
And the fact Cloud's personality goes from depressed to euphoric and back more times than an emo with ecstacy
The fact that the main villain Sephiroth is fatally wounded about 3 weeks before the game starts and then proceeds to sit in a cave for the entire game crying for "mother" until the main characters decide "I know, lets defeat Sephiroth by strolling up to him and GIVING him the instrument to destroy our world! WHHEEEEE!!!!?!?11!!1!"
And don't say he killed Aeris, that was Jenova disguised as him

But all in all it's not a bad game, just no where near as awesome as the rest, but to be fair, I did play all of em except for 1, 2, 3, 12 and 10-2 first so I'm not as effected by the whole "First one I ever played" deal as many people are

I like FF7, and I only have two issues with it - one is Cloud, the other Sephiroth. Cloud is, IMHO, totally unlikeable and absolutely boring. The only fun parts about him are all really parts of Zack. Seph, while in principle very similiar to Kefka, is horribly overhyped.
These two being the plot's driving element for the begginning of the game doesn't help, since it's basically Cloud chasing Sephy and the rest tagging along.

That being said, I still like FF7. I like the overall plot, the gameplay and the materia system. It has one of myfavourite Cids in the series and many other characters I very much like.

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I loved FFVII, it was my first FF game... (OK, I was 4, but, whatever)

...but I just DESPISE the compilation. They've turned everything FFVII into a cash cow, and they're just milking it so all the blind FFVII fanboys can buy shallow spinoffs. This may not be how most feel, but I hate what they've done to FFVII as a whole...

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FFIVDS looks awesome, right? Especially the character scans. I mean, look at that CGI scan of Yang. You see it and you just think...badass. And then you look at his polka-dot pants, likely stolen from a Dr. Seuss book. And then you just...shiver.

I think a lot of the obsession from this game comes from the fact that it was the first one that a lot of current FF fans played. Really, ut was 3-D, with fancy schmancy backgrounds, summons, characters and the like. It was the first FF I can think of that was advertised on TV. It even had guys with strange hair with giant and awkward swords fighting. It was a definition of cool, at least back then.

It's at least my two cents that people tend to prefer the FF they play first. I played FF4 and 6 first, so they're my favorites. I've obsessed over both of them, and I can only assume it's the same with the FF7 fans.

The hatred probably stems from the fact that 'old school' FF fans saw that FF7 was good, but still flawed. A ho-hum plot, an uninspired hero, a villian I really don't care about (I usually just turn off the game as soon as it prompts me to insert disc 3.), translation errors and the fact that characters are just limit breaks, not really individuals beyond that. Well, and the fact that Barret is just proof that the Japanese need to stop watching 80s American tv shows.

The hatred turned to pure vitriol with the sheer amount of obsession with the FF7 fans. I mean really, the whole spinoff empire. How many times do Cloud and Sephiroth have to fight? I didn't really care the first time, why must they put it out five more times?

Granted, I think the hatred, or at least in my case, is mostly knee-jerk reaction to either the hype or obsession. It IS a decent game, just not the greatest game of all time. The setting is almost delightfully dystopian, and it is almost frighteningly plausible sometimes. But then again, the vast majority of the game is just chasing one guy and when you don't really give a hoot or hate that guy, you can't really love the game, just think it's decent.

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Quote (Hamedo @ 5th December 2007 13:45)

I disagree.  I disliked the game very, very much.  I could give a damn if that makes me look trendy or retro or whatever.

Yes but you, and many like you, are excluded as far as I'm aware. This is about why the game is hated and loved; like the Xbox and Sony these days. My point is that some people, like you, think it's flawed, but still worth a play as you've said. It's just the exception of certain people genuinely hating it. On the flip side, there are fans, like myself, who love the game. As Kylerocks said, it was the first time I played a game so inspiring. If they'd released III in the UK at the time I'd certainly put that above VII. My point: it's not universally hated by everyone who doesn't like the game, it just seems that way because there's certain people who dislike parts and that's usually what comes up in a discussion. Also I've noticed a trend of some people (not everyone Hamedo!) wanting to look "retro", especially on this board, and VII is sometimes slated in passing.

Edit for below: We all weren't so lucky as to live outside Europe in the early 90s. I didn't even care that VII was the seventh in a series at the time. It's inspiring because there was a huge world to explore with interesting characters and an engaging plot. That doesn't mean it's better than VI - unless there's nothing to compare it to.

This post has been edited by sweetdude on 6th December 2007 23:15

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Scepticism, that dry rot of the intellect, had not left one entire idea in his mind.

Me on the Starcraft.

Well, we could all diss FFVIII to fit in, but then I'm one of the few who likes that one.

I don't get the label "inspiring" when people try to slap it on FFVII. FFVI was a far superior game, IMO, that had better music, playstyle, plot, and more engaging characters.

If FFVI been made in the same early 3D graphics as FFVII was, we would right now be heralding it as the greatest FF ever made, and I would be tempted to agree.

This post has been edited by Hamedo on 7th December 2007 02:43

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Join the Army, see the world, meet interesting people - and kill them.

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I don't understand why everyone dogs on FFVIII... I personally greatly enjoyed the game, I thought the junction system was interesting and that the story was engaging, I mean c'mon who doesn't like falling in love ?? haha not to mention the whole orphan SeeD thing, and being able to go back n forth between laguna and squall...idk I like it when the FF series incorporates technology into their games, what's wrong with having Magic AND technology?? I don't know...

It all boils down to people having different tastes. Some people don't like certain songs, others find Mayonaise disgusting, some hate FF VII. Sure, sometimes these dislikes can be boiled down to key components that make logical sense but sometimes they can't as it's a part of how things are right down to the core. How does one define the quality of a story for themselves or how good graphics are? Sure, you can say Cloud is overly blocky looking but what's annoying about the blockiness in itself? And again, you can say climbing stairs is tedious and boring but then again, you could call it a finite detail of the character's lives.

Forgive me for sounding like a broken record, when I say it's all about personal taste but that's pretty much the only answer there is.

I might like to add that hatred for this game seems more prevalent because it's a part of pop culture. You see, everything, no matter what it is, has its critics. There are virtually no exceptions. However, some things are very well received by the masses and end up spreading like wild fire. When this happens, more and more people are introduced to something new to critique. Because of this, there is a directly larger number of people who find the subject matter disagreeable and you're proportionally more likely to run into them. It seems like a lot of people hate FF VII more then other final fantasies but I'd say the truth is that there's just more awareness and people don't often consider the exponential effect of this.

For example, how many people have you heard of people who hate Star Wars. Plenty, right?
Now how many of you know of somebody who hates Cave Story. Likely very few, if not none at all.

Now compare that to how many people are aware of Star Wars in proportion to how many have heard of Cave Story and I think you'll find my point to be proven, probably. That's my theory on why FF VII is "so disliked" or any aspect of pop culture for that matter.

This post has been edited by Tonepoet on 7th December 2007 05:07

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Role reversal at its finest.

he's quite right you know. completely about taste

Whats Cave Story?

Moderator Edit

It's irrelevant to the topic. But you can PM Tonepoet or search the forums to find out. -R51

This post has been edited by Rangers51 on 7th December 2007 16:48

As a game, it's perfectly enjoyable and actually one of the better in the franchise.

As a narrative, it's a worthless hodgepodge of anime cliche and pretension. The characters are two dimensional parading around as 'complex' whenever the script asks of it without making any real explanation for their sudden lapses into overly melodramatic or outright bizarre behavior.

Like the majority of pop culture anime, it's a simple story trying to pass off inconsistency as intelligent and 'deep' and it's a large reason I gather why it's become such a popular game in the series. It gives you the illusion you're experiencing something thought provoking, even if it's just a silly story under all the fabrication.

This post has been edited by Narratorway on 8th December 2007 00:12

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I liked it before, but now because of all those other stuff, i dont like it as much. But i heard Crisis Core is pretty good.