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ok, there will be MUCHO SPOILERAGE below...




anyway, I just got Cloud back after he gets sick from Mako poisioning, and when he spilled the beans about his real past with shinra, right after Sephiroth smited Zack, Cloud went after him and then Sephiroth stabbed Cloud....Cloud then seemed to pick Sephiroth up by leaning back (i think) Then threw him into a wall...AM i supposed to know why he could do this? Or do i find out later....I know he was a failed experiment, but how could that be a failure

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stupid horoscope
wrong again

The way I see it, he'd never been experimented on at this point.  It's his sheer anger and hatred for Sephiroth that gives him the strength to throw him into the Mako.  (Which is how he ends up in a ball of it at Northern Cave, presumably.)

If you haven't already done it since that lifestream episode, head down to the basement of the Shinra mansion, to the library, for the rest of the story.

Quote (Tiddles the Cat @ 28 Jan. 2003, 17:18)

If you haven't already done it since that lifestream episode, head down to the basement of the Shinra mansion, to the library, for the rest of the story.

Eh? I don't remember if I ever did that...I'd feel pretty stupid if I didn't.

This is why I love FF7. It's so open to interpretation. I agree with Tiddles on this one. He couldn't handle seeing his town and friends reduced to nothing, so overpowered him with sheer anger.

Now I thought Cloud got the standard mako, but the whole deal with him being a failed experiment? I think Hojo was just being an idiot and confusing him with Zach. At least, I think that's what I thought.    I made up a whole opinion and explanation for the whole thing after I had freshly played ff7, but now I can't remember it. I should have written it down.

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The clouds ran away, opened up the sky
And one by one I watched every constellation die
And there I was frozen, standing in my backyard
Face to face, eye to eye, staring at the last star
I should've known, walked all the way home
To find that she wasn't here, I'm still all alone

-Atmosphere "Always Coming Back Home to You"

Spoiler, if you haven't been to the library:

SPOILER ALERT!  Highlight to view:

Cloud and Zack are shown in two tanks, being experimented up.  Hojo is clearly lying about Cloud being created after the Nibelheim incident (or does he even say that bit?  Maybe it was just Sephiroth.) but he was experimented on then (and quite possibly brought back to life, in some respect, since he must have been critically injured after the encounter with Sephiroth).  We have to assume that Zack was infused with Jenova cells/Mako previously, as well, being a member of SOLDIER, but not such a high dosage, though he was clearly able to handle the experiment better than Cloud. Hojo's experiments at that time with Jenova cells did seem to be geared towards creating Sephiroth "clones", so in that respect, Cloud was indeed a failed experiment.  Though he was the one that succeeded in the end.

since i am on the topic of FF7, i just realized I am somewhat close to the end of the game.....and i am only in the high forties tops in levels....i am wondering if i am screwed and have to fight nonstop before i do anything else

(this game seems really short to me..compared to FF6...)

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stupid horoscope
wrong again

Somehow FF6 does feel longer, but I'm not sure that it is.  If you do everything in the WoR it might just be.  The nonlinearity of that part of the game makes it seem much longer and more fulfilling.

But anyway.  I think you'll be fine on those levels for now.  You may have some challenging battles, but that makes it more entertaining.  You'll be a fair bit higher before you face the end of the game just from following the main plot thread, I'm sure.

heh...guess i just keep encountering problems in FF7....

Windows XP is odd with FF7, i used a patch on it, but now it has for reasons unknown, starting freezing up during Cid's Limit "Hyper Jump"... nearly everytime it freezes...and i won't stop using Cid's limit if i can find a more reasonable solution, although i don't expect everyone to encounter this problem on the PC version and with WIndows XP

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stupid horoscope
wrong again

During the lifestream sequence you learn Cloud has a real attitude problem. This porblem of his got him into many fights so he could never graduate from Soldier. I do remember Zack saying that Cloud did have what it takes. Also remember Cloud never was exposed to mako and Zack was. Zack may have been more resistant to Mako than Cloud. Even though Cloud was a failure of Hojo's. Sephiroth was beaten by one of his own failed clone's his puppet.

And when you look at that Gogo you're right how is that a failure?

When did Zack say he had the potential?  The fights that were referred to were in Nibelheim, there's no indication given of why he didn't make it into SOLDIER, as far as I remember.  He just didn't.  It's fair to guess that he got into fights, but he doesn't seem to have that personality in the Kalm flashback (only relevant for the bits that were really Cloud's memories, of course, and some of them were.  I don't think Zack went to stay with Cloud's mother, that would be nuts.  And talking to the Shinra soldier that was actually Cloud, of course.)

Remember, Cloud says that you get injected with Jenova cells when you enter SOLDIER, rather than being infused with Mako.  The Mako thing is just what Shinra tell people.  You can see evidence of this from the former SOLDIER weapons shop guy in Junon, who's wearing a black cape later in the game, but otherwise isn't badly affected.  They only pick people for SOLDIER, we assume, who they think/know can take that level of Jenova augmentation and retain their own minds.  It's obvious after the library flashback that Zack can take it much, much more easily than Cloud.  If you ask me, that's the reason Cloud didn't make it into SOLDIER.  He just wasn't strong enough for it, for whatever reason (I assume this has a lot to do with mental strength as well, and Cloud isn't the strongest minded guy we know, this is clear.  Maybe he is a bit more towards the end).

Sephiroth's "clones" (it's still a REALLY bad name for them - Cloud isn't a clone, he's just a guy who got massively infected by Jenova crap - though Clone #1 must either be a real clone, or, more likely, Sephiroth can change the form of good candidate clones and take over them.  "The power to change one's face, voice and words, is the power of Jenova.") weren't SUPPOSED to defeat Sephiroth.  I'd say that's a pretty bad failure.  But Hojo isn't even around any more when Cloud beats Seph, so it's a moot point.

He saved the world, but he's a failure as far as Hojo's experiment was concerned.

Anyway.  FF7 PC was never programmed well to begin with, I've heard of this sort of thing happening on other OSes as well.  Make sure you have the version 1.2 patch ("The NVidia patch", badly named because you don't need an NVidia card, it just adds options for them - plus, it fixes other things) with the XP patch applied over it.  Other than that, you may have to use another character or avoid those limits, sadly.

It is suggested for Windows 95 or 98. The game freezes up for 2000 when you first fight the two MPs at the very, very beginning of the game, and the opening FMV might show up backwards.

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Nine-hundred ninety-nine billion nine-hundered ninety-nine million nine-hundred ninety-nine thousand nine-hundred ninety-nine bottles of beer on the wall...

It doesn't necessarily freeze up when you fight them, it tends to be rather system and GFX card dependent.  Like I said, use the NVidia patch and the XP patch (even for 2000).  There's also a patch to fix the video if it doesn't show or is reversed, which is listed as a fix for the latter problem.

I've been able to run it on XP reasonably well, but I haven't played through.  These things might fix the problem, they might not.

But you're quite right, if you have 9x (that includes the horrible Windows ME) it has a much better chance of working, especially if you have an old 3dfx graphics card.

nah, i ran it under the Windows 98 compatibility and it worked just fine. After that i chased down th e "Ultimate Weapon". At least I'm pretty sure that is what it was called. I had to fight it about 5 times...I didn't think it was the ultimate weapon when i was chasingi it..and i Beat it really easily..I was disappointed, expecially since the Emerald Weapon totally squished everyone in about three turns.

SPOILER ALERT


I was Disappointed by the fact that Zack died so...SO easily...I mean if he had what it takes to join Soldier, and was also infused with Jenova cells...and two soldiers were able to take him out?  

another thing...Why was Cloud infused with Jenova cells if he wasn't in Soldier?

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stupid horoscope
wrong again

Because Hojo did it in order to move along the clone process.

He did it to everyone in Nibelheim after the accident, presumably.  This explains all the black-caped people hanging around when you first get back there.  Especially notice the two little ones.  They're obviously meant to be the kids who were there in the flashback.

Of course, we can only see two tanks in the basement, but still.

And yeah, that was Ultimate Weapon.  Now you've defeated it, you can find Ruby Weapon in the quicksand near the Gold Saucer, and you can attempt the Ancient Forest.  But you probably knew that already.

Quote (gogo @ 31 Jan 2003, 18:04)

I was Disappointed by the fact that Zack died so...SO easily...I mean if he had what it takes to join Soldier, and was also infused with Jenova cells...and two soldiers were able to take him out?

Two soldiers? Wasn't it Sephiroth?

--------------------

The clouds ran away, opened up the sky
And one by one I watched every constellation die
And there I was frozen, standing in my backyard
Face to face, eye to eye, staring at the last star
I should've known, walked all the way home
To find that she wasn't here, I'm still all alone

-Atmosphere "Always Coming Back Home to You"

Nope.  See the basement scene.  But another good point is that it somehow doesn't ring true that Zack survived Sephiroth but went on to be taken out by Shinra soldiers with machine guns.  But then, there were the Jenova experiments after the Sephiroth incident, and who knows what effect that has.

i thought he was a goner after Sephiroth...now i have another question..

I just beat the ultimate weapon, and im out of things to do. I know a few, but im not strong enough yet. SO, do i need to just level up, or is there some other side quest around...

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stupid horoscope
wrong again

Breed Gold Chocobos that'll keep you occupied for a long time. So you might as well have some extra reserves of popcorn.

Have you done Yuffie's side quest in Wutai and teh left-most continent?

I'm gonna have to bust out one of my save games for FF7 then...

--------------------

The clouds ran away, opened up the sky
And one by one I watched every constellation die
And there I was frozen, standing in my backyard
Face to face, eye to eye, staring at the last star
I should've known, walked all the way home
To find that she wasn't here, I'm still all alone

-Atmosphere "Always Coming Back Home to You"

I leveled up to around 40 to beat demons gate... the rest of the game was strangely easy.... wonder why?

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"Only the dead have seen the end of their quotes being misattributed to Plato."
-George Santayana

"The world will little note, nor long remember what we say here..."
-Abraham Lincoln, prior to the discovery of Irony.

Yeah i did the Wutai, and as for chocobos, i don't know what to do to get started, i have a chocobo in a stable, and i know it couldn't win a race if it's life depended on it...

Demon's Gate? wha?

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stupid horoscope
wrong again

Quote (gogo @ 29 Jan 2003, 21:38)

heh...guess i just keep encountering problems in FF7.... Windows XP is odd with FF7, i used a patch on it, but now it has for reasons unknown, starting freezing up during Cid's Limit "Hyper Jump"... nearly everytime it freezes...and i won't stop using Cid's limit if i can find a more reasonable solution, although i don't expect everyone to encounter this problem on the PC version and with WIndows XP

hey I had same problems too! Did you use that limi on North CAve?
--

Hmmm I don't understand, I do understand that Cloud wasn't born in Niblehem, but then where was he born/created?

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I will be there...

Cloud WAS born in Nibelheim.  Cloud IS the Cloud Tifa remembers.  Everything you see of his past until he leaves to join SOLDIER is true.  The only thing that was false was his recollection that he was in SOLDIER, when he was justa regular Shinra guard.  This is all corrected in the Lifestream.  It is after this that Hojo experiments on him with Jenova cells, and his mind gets all messed up.

Quote (Tiddles the Cat @ 1 Feb 2003, 13:16)

Nope.  See the basement scene.  But another good point is that it somehow doesn't ring true that Zack survived Sephiroth but went on to be taken out by Shinra soldiers with machine guns.  But then, there were the Jenova experiments after the Sephiroth incident, and who knows what effect that has.

Well, that really brings some closure to the whole Zack deal that I never had. That sucks he had to get shot up though. Seemed like he would have made a good character at least.

--------------------

The clouds ran away, opened up the sky
And one by one I watched every constellation die
And there I was frozen, standing in my backyard
Face to face, eye to eye, staring at the last star
I should've known, walked all the way home
To find that she wasn't here, I'm still all alone

-Atmosphere "Always Coming Back Home to You"