Just curious, because I'm at the point in the game now where I'm going to Narshe with Locke and I will be given that choice.
I haven't played FF6 since about 94, and I was only 11 so I don't remember what I got last time. I'm thinking of getting it as a sword and betting it for the Illumina. I can always learn Ultima from the Paladin Shield, but how long does that take?

The sword is not worth it atma weapon and excalibur are way better
plus as a magicite it lets you learn ULTIMA

Take the sword. With the Paladin Shield you can learn Ultima just as fast as if you had the Esper Ragnarok, at a rate of Ultima x1. Excalibur isn't better than either Ragnarok or Illumina (if you wagered Ragnarok in the colosseum), it's battle bower is only 217 as opposed to 255, and the other stats don't go up nearly as high. And Atma Weapon can become more powerful than any sword, but you'll have to level up pretty high for it to become so. So your best bet is taking the sword Ragnarok and wagering it in the Colosseum for an even better sword, Illumina. Only get the Esper if you want the ability to transform enemies into items, items for the most part you can easily get elsewhere.

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yeah but I agree with painsake, the ragnarok isn't that good for when you equip genji glove it doesnt use its ability, or the second sword doesnt attack sometimes
But ragnarok is also useful in getting the sword Illumina so its a tough call but i still say magicite is better For the ragnarok sword is really weak withuot its ability

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I say Esper. I wnated to learn Ultima with two peeps at once... (sheild and magicite)

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The_Pink_Nu1 is right. Since the Paladin Sheild teaches Ultima, what do you need the esper for? The summon? Ya gotta be kiddin' me!

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I went with the sword.
Thanks for the opinions.

Noooooooo!!!!!!! I voted for the esper--I want to learn Ultima NOW!

That's actually true. I don't really feel like uncursing the shield just to learn Ultima--that would mean even more unnecessary battles. Personally, I'm not the kind of person who really needs very powerful weapons; I'm more of a defensive and endurance-oriented player, preferring to use my MP for offensive magic and healing than to get an extraordinarily powerful weapon which can't teach me any magic. I think magic's cooler, too. (Plus, you should know that the Ragnarok sword is only the 3rd most powerful; the Illumina is the most poweful, but you need to bet the Ragnarok in the Colosseum to get it. Without the upgrade, the Ragnarok is beaten by the Excalibur (and some would add the AtmaWeapon). Now I don't like fighting in the Colosseum--for me, it is merely a waste of time unless I am fighting for Shadow's Tack Stars, which I don't normally use anyways in the final battle because I usually don't lose enough characters to get to him.)

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Good call on the sword. That's what I always go with. I get the Paladin Shield anyways, and it's not that difficult to do depending on where you battle.

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I've never actually uncursed the Cursed Shield...I'm just not patient enough to do that. I mean, if I got Locke earlier in the World of Ruin I could probably uncurse it just by wearing it around, but I usually save him for last, because I'm a slave to routine. I've also gotten the Ragnarok summon to get me some very useful relics, like the Genji Glove, and that's always a plus.

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i always take the esper. i always go for a perfect game. its possible(although hard) if you get the esper. however, it is impossible if take the sword.

plus, who needs it? the game already supplies everybody with kickass stuff. granted the need for ultima is just as redundant, but whateva.

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i don't were the paladin shield on my way through WoR, unless you have a ribbon, it just screws you... which i do, then just head for the veldt. if you're patient enough for the shield, and have the magicite, then you can teach two people ultima at once, which was previously stated, and i'm just realizing that. or put them both on one person and learn it twice as fast.

sdm

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Pick the sword, the paladins shield can also give you Ultima. I think you have to get in 250 fight with the Cursed Shield to get the Paladins shield. Be sure to equip a ribbon when you are fighting with it. I screwed up and took the summon. Now I'm mad about it.

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eh--both have their merits. this basically boils down to which the player prefers. im sticking with the magicite.


oh and the word, "were" is either the contraction of "we are" or "were" which is past tense for doing something. you were(there is an example right there) looking for the term "wear". as in, "i wanted to wear the paladin shield,".

sorry to nitpick, but you wouldnt want that to happen again, and get mauled by someone not at as nice as me, right? and besides, we all make mistakes

you know what would suck? if i made some mistake on this post. i could re-read, but i wont. hopefully i did screw up. at least then we all can enjoy the irony.



This post has been edited by Tiddles on 23rd November 2003 12:48

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My personal opinion is get the Sword. The only use for the Magicite is to have the advantage of learning Ultima earlier on, because the Esper attack is pointless (unless all of your characters have Fire Redundant Armor), other than the fact that I think it's the coolest of the Esper attacks.

If you wait till you uncurse the Cursed Shield (if you decide to do so), you've probably by then already learned many of the other spells you wouldn't have learned while waiting to acquire Ultima, so it all works out the same. Plus, hanging around the Maranda desert with the Hoovers and Cactuars is an easy way to acquire any spell within any means of time.

Illumina is strong as a biatch, and when used in conjuction with another sword (Atma Weapon?) and a good fighter holding the Offering and Genji Glove , boy, you can kill mad stuff.

Also, can anyone explain to me just what those three Bad-@$$ looking dudes in the Esper attack are and who they are? I'm clueless other than they're Espers. Or maybe Gods or Titans.. I dunno' .. I'm ramblin' again.

Quick question. If I unequip the cursed shield, will it reset the counter?
I've fought 60 battles with it equipped so far, and getting bored. I want to go back to the Fanatic's Tower AGAIN.
I was one point away from learning Life 3 when I got to the boss, and grrrr I didn't know he would cast ultima at the end. So needless to say, I died.

You're thinking of the esper Crusader. Ragnarok announces "Better off [insert name of item a given enemy can be morphed into]!" and then a sword slams into the enemy. Crusader deals a huge fire attack against all allies and enemies, and teaches Merton at x1. Ragnarok teaches Ultima at x1, and is the other way to get items from enemies (the first being stealing).

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I always go for the Esper. I know that the sword might be a little better if we take both items side by side and discuss their pro:s and con:s and all that. But, I don't know, somehow I feel I want the esper more than the sword. I mean, good swords are everywhere in the game, but there's only one Ragnarok esper.

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From the responses in this thread it seems that you really can't go wrong with either choice. It just depends on what you want to do. I can dig it.

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I took the esper everytime, no reason, I just value espers more than weapons, even though I can get a shield to do the same thing.

yeah, if you unequip the cursed shield, the timer resets. onr of my buddies found this out the hard way. twice.

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I'd always take the sword. Why? Because that's the way I do it. There is also no reason to not take the sword. The best sword in the game ... plus you learn Ultima from the Pally Shield.

If you are complaining because you can't use the Spell Added abilities with a Genji glove then IMO you should rethink it a bit. The use of a Genji Glove with the Illumina or Ragnarok with the Atma Weapon is pure cheese on a cracker. There is no reason for one character to wield both of these swords at once, hehe.

The Ragnarok Esper however, in no way could it ever serve me any purpose. Why would I take something useless?

And as for n00binators perfect game ... either way you go, you won't have a perfect game because you can't use Ragnarok or Illumina until the final battle. That's if you can manage to steal it. Have fun.

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Hey I stole both the Atma Weapon and the Ragnarok both times I wasted Kefka's rear end. It is easily possible if you work to keep Locke alive from the first team on (rather than putting him in after the first team and trying to get him in by making sure somebody gets knocked out).

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I've taken the Esper both times I've played the game so far, mostly because I like having a full Esper list. Plus Espers are just cool in general. But I think the next time I play, I'm going to take the sword instead. Despite what I just said about Espers, I'm not a big item-hound, so I never actually used the Ragnarok summon. So if I get the sword next time, that'll give me a reason to hang out at the Coliseum more, plus it'll give me the incentive to actually try to uncurse the Cursed Shield. I don't think any Final Fantasy game is complete unless at least one of your characters can cast Ultima (or the functional equivalent) by the end of the game, and Meteor and Merton, cool as they are, just don't cut it for me in the final fight against Kefka. Ultima and Holy all the way.

I for one always choose the sword. Learning Ultima is tedious though can be worth it. But the sword itself can be very useful.

I have a question: how does the power of the Illumina sword, equipped on the most powerful (highest attack power) character at level 50 (assuming, for the sake ofsimplicity, that there are no esper bonuses involved, and considering only sword users), compare to lv.50 Setzer equipped with the Fixed Dice or lv.50 Locke/Edgar (whoever has more HP) equipped with the AtmaWeapon since you found it in the Cave to the Sealed Gate?

Also, is 9999 a possibility, and if it is, how frequent is it and how does that compare to the other two weapons?

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The damage on Illumina at Level 50 is higher than that of the Atma Weapon I do believe. I know that with the Illumina you critical almost every time you swing it. At least, my characters do. I don't know if it is actually supposed to do it or not, but it knocks the 9999 rate way up. At the time that I got the Illumina (Level 20 somthin) I was hitting in the 5,000 range.

Plus the added Holy effect and evade % you get from the sword is incredible. Blows the Atma Weapon away until you have the HP to make the Atma Weapon useful.

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"The sword is not worth it atma weapon and excalibur are way better." quoted from Painsake
"And Atma Weapon can become more powerful than any sword, but you'll have to level up pretty high for it to become so." quoted from The_Pink_Nu1'

I must strongly disagree. The Atma Weapon is cool, but let's compare differences.

* Max damage from 1 hit from Illumina can do 19,998 dam. Max damage from 1 hit from Atma Weapon can do 9,999.

* If Illumina doesn't do its special Pearl attack, then Atma Weapon could be better, because it Ignores Defense.

EDIT: This means you have a distinct advantage over high defense monsters (DEF > 200) when using the Atma Weapon. Those 15 monsters are: Cactrot, Tritoch, Bloompire, Uroburos, MagiMaster, Air Force Speck, ProtoArmor, Adamanchyt, Garm, Delta Bug, Magic Urn, Ifrit, Commando, and Luridan. And unless you encounter them later on the Veldt, you wont even have an Atma Weapon during your first encounter for 4 of those.

* Illumina has 100% hit probability. Atma Weapon does not.

* Atma Weapon doesn't reach its potential until your Level is greater than 64 and you have hp=maxhp. ie. Illumina's average damage is greater than Atma Weapon's average damage before L64.

* Illumina has MPTurbo. So it does a crithit every round.

* Illumina has chance to cast Pearl. There are only a handful of enemies in the game which are immune to or absorb Pearl/Holy. So this is an excellent special (even compared to other specials).

* Illumina is SDBR (Same Damage Back Row), which means you take less damage on defense and still dish out awesome damage.

* Illumina gives +7 to all 4 stats.

* Illumina provides 50% MBlock%.

In the rare case that you are battling Cactrots to earn MP, Atma Weapon may be the route to go. Even then you need to get at least 2 hits to kill it. Alternatively, if you get lucky and get the Illumina Pearl, you could win in 1 round. So even in the rare situation where Atma Weapon has the advantage (versus high DEF critters), Atma Weapon is not the hands down best weapon.

Based on that, I'm gonna have to go with the Illumina in every other situation.

Detah
Ruler of 2D

I think we're on the same page here, I definitely prefer Illumina over Excalibur/Atma Weapon/Ragnarok. I said Atma Weapon COULD be more powerful, simply because if the random Pearl spell doesn't execute with Illumina, Atma Weapon is more powerful. But Illumina is great because of that Pearl spell, (Note that Illumina's Pearl is more powerful than casting the spell "Pearl".)

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Haha... damn, making it a Sword is so much more beneficial in the long run.. one of the most common reasons is the fact that so, its really handy to have either weapon around during those later times in the game when that old Crystal Sword doesnt quite cut it anymore against Kefka, heh.

Plus, once you uncurse the Cursed Shield you can begin to learn Ultima anyway, one or two party members might miss out (due to not being able to equip the shield) eh, no extreme issue.. they can counter with their abilities im sure .